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Did you read all my post? It explained that it will happen after Israel is divided.

Yes. And obviously you didn't read mine. The book was not opened to the 83rd Psalm. So there is no warning from God.

Try reading Psalm 84 and getting that 'message'. It don't work.

Edited by Genevanpreacher

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in reply to Ian:

Clearly, if we read the Scriptures through your eyes, Eric, that we CANNOT understand the Scriptures, nor prophecy, by reading God's word, & NO-ONE in the previous 2,000 years had any chance of knowing what we know now, nor of understanding Scripture the way you do. Even in the life-time of most of us, the technology you rely on for your opinions was unheard of. 

Peter is very specific about OT prophecy focusing on Christ & his church:

1 Peter 1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
10 Of which salvation the prophets have inquired and searched diligently, whoprophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.
12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.
13 Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ;

Note YOU, US.

Interesting that you should bring up Isaiah 25 again. I like to use it as Peter said Isaiah intended, as both were moved by the Spirit of Christ, the Holy Ghost:

6 And in this mountain shall the LORD of hosts make unto all people a feast of fat things, a feast of wines on the lees, of fat things full of marrow, of wines on the lees well refined.
7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations.
8 He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.
9 And it shall be said in that day, Lo, this is our God; we have waited for him, and he will save us: this is the LORD; we have waited for him, we will be glad and rejoice in his salvation.

Has it occurred to you, Eric, that Isaiah could be prophesying Calvary? 

Brethren,

It is only partially doctrinally correct to say that Isaiah 25 and 1 Peter 1:9-13 is a reference to Calvary. 

Isaiah 25:6-12 and 1 Peter 1:9-13 is speaking of Calvary, "and the glory that should follow." 1 Peter 1:11 is a direct reference to the 1000 (Millennial) reign of Christ in Revelation 20:3-7. To say that these verses are reference's to Calvary and not mention the true fulfillment of the prophecy of Isaiah and the Apostle Peter is not the entire truth of the future work, and coming glory, of the Lord Jesus.

Did you notice that I was replying to Eric about his gross misinterpretation of Isaiah 25? Peter's point (& mine) is that the prophets were writing concerning the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow. Peter is writing to real, living people, who are suffering persecution yet rejoicing in their salvation.     

Isaiah 25:7, "And he shall destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the veil that is spread over all nations." Is not a reference to Calvary but it is  a reference to the Millennial Reign of Christ as spoken in Revelation 20:3-7

Isaiah is writing about the triumph of Christ on "this mountain" where, by his death & resurrection he did triumph over death, hell, Satan & sin -  through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; Certainly the triumph at Calvary has secured eternal life for those who believe in him, but that live begins NOW. The veil is death - the wages of sin - but as believers we have passed from death to life. If we do not come to Christ for salvation NOW then the supposed future millennium cannot provide eternal life. 

But Peter knows nothing of a future millennium - he refers to it as an indefinite present time 2 Peter 3:8 that will end when the Lord returns to bring into being  new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.   

Isaiah 25:8, "He will swallow up death in victory; and the LORD God will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it." The reference in the New Testament to this verse, and the fulfilment of this prophecy, is not a reference or a fulfilment in Calvary; but, it is a prophecy of the new glorified body that every saint receives in the coming of the Lord Jesus (1 Corinthians 15:42-57), and all tears will be taken away after the Millennium as spoken of in Revelation 21:4

1 Corinthians 15:54, "So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written. Death is swallowed up in victory." This is a direct reference to Isaiah 25:8 and it is not referring to Calvary it is referring to the resurrection and is still future.

Revelation 21:4, "And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." This is the direct reference, and fulfilment, of Isaiah 25:8 and it is not a reference to Calvary but to the time, after the Millinnial Reign of Christ, and after the Great White Throne of Judgment; but during the formation of the New Heaven and the New Earth that God fulfills Isaiah 25:8

So, where in you millennial teaching is Isaiah's mountain where Christ gains his victory over death? 

I do hope that this short study will be a blessing and a help to all in understanding the ultimate fulfilling of Isaiah 25:6-12 and 1 Peter 1:9-13

Of course God's ultimate purpose is eternal glory & peace in the NH&NE (not the supposed millennium, which has an end) but we need to read the Scriptures addressed to real, living believers, NOT some supposed future generation. The OT Scriptures look to Christ & those who believe in him in the Gospel age, as Peter carefully explains, while the letters are addressed to present suffering believers for their/our encouragement. 

Ian   

Alan

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Brethren,

It is only partially doctrinally correct to say that Isaiah 25 and 1 Peter 1:9-13 is a reference to Calvary. 

Isaiah 25:6-12 and 1 Peter 1:9-13 is speaking of Calvary, "and the glory that should follow." 1 Peter 1:11 is a direct reference to the 1000 (Millennial) reign of Christ in Revelation 20:3-7. To say that these verses are reference's to Calvary and not mention the true fulfillment of the prophecy of Isaiah and the Apostle Peter is not the entire truth of the future work, and coming glory, of the Lord Jesus.

Isaiah 25:7, "And he shall destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the veil that is spread over all nations." Is not a reference to Calvary but it is  a reference to the Millennial Reign of Christ as spoken in Revelation 20:3-7

Isaiah 25:8, "He will swallow up death in victory; and the LORD God will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it." The reference in the New Testament to this verse, and the fulfilment of this prophecy, is not a reference or a fulfilment in Calvary; but, it is a prophecy of the new glorified body that every saint receives in the coming of the Lord Jesus (1 Corinthians 15:42-57), and all tears will be taken away after the Millennium as spoken of in Revelation 21:4

1 Corinthians 15:54, "So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written. Death is swallowed up in victory." This is a direct reference to Isaiah 25:8 and it is not referring to Calvary it is referring to the resurrection and is still future.

Revelation 21:4, "And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." This is the direct reference, and fulfilment, of Isaiah 25:8 and it is not a reference to Calvary but to the time, after the Millinnial Reign of Christ, and after the Great White Throne of Judgment; but during the formation of the New Heaven and the New Earth that God fulfills Isaiah 25:8

I do hope that this short study will be a blessing and a help to all in understanding the ultimate fulfilling of Isaiah 25:6-12 and 1 Peter 1:9-13

Alan

 

 

a blessing , Amen

Thank Your Brother

God bless

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Covenanter,

If you read my post carefully I puposely addressed it the, "Brethren," as I tried to keep personalities out of the short study.  I puposely did not mention any names in order to try and keep peace among the brethren. As Isaiah 25 was brought up by Eric I felt it was appropriate to respond as I did. I purposely tried to just give the correct spiritual interpretation of Isaiah 25:6-12 and 1 Peter 1:9-13. In my opinion, I think both you and Eric missed the boat on the complete interpretation of Isaiah 25:6-12 and 1 Peter 1:9-13

Please look at the words, "partially." Ian, if you read it carefully you will notice that I partially agreed with you; and still do. 

As this thread is Eric's, and I do not want to distrupt his thread any further with my comments. So, I do not think it appropriate to comment on your comments to my post.

Brethren,

Although I do not plan on commenting on the comments of Covenanter's reply to my post I think it is a good study as it stands and do not think I need to change anything.

EKSmith,

Thank you very much for enjoying the short study on Isaiah 25:6-12 and 1 Peter 1:9-13. It is a blessing to me to know that the Lord blessed it.

In Christ,

Alan

 

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Did you read all my post? It explained that it will happen after Israel is divided.

Time.

 

No not the end of time, that is a fixture in the minds of Futurists,  It is the end of the period that is spoken about.

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It Is Time

 

The RFID chip makes the mark of the beast and the ability to restrict buying and selling possible.

Yes satellites and TV and internet make viewing the two witnesses possible.

Technology has increased knowledge as Daniel 12:4 foretold.

Cars, airplanes, rockets, and fuels have man running to and fro as Daniel 12:4 foretold. 

Isaiah 25:4-7 tells us that the blast of the terrible ones will destroy the veil and covering over all nations. That is why the heaven rolls up as a scroll in Revelation 6:14. The destruction of the atmosphere will cause the sun to burn men as fire in Revelation 16:8-9.

 

I think you have some good points there, It seems to me that it is Anti-Christ which needs technology not God, he is using it more and more to try and be like God, he has cameras everywhere so he can be all seeing, he has ears every where so he can be all knowing, (I have just done a quick count of where I am sitting, the double room has got at least 7cameras in it, and six mikes that I know of) he is building a total awareness network so he can know everything, he has energy weapons of various kinds (see exotic weaponry (not the games or the science fiction)) some of which could hit a target from satellite, those 'sophisticated sound weapons' they have can knock out electrical power, inflict pain max from over a mile, put voices into peoples minds, cause feelings of terror or depression, just like putting Drugs into the blood can effect the mind by attaching to receptors in the brain, they can use specificly tuned low power radio signals now to target those same receptors in the brain so the brain thinks there are chemicals there which aren't there.

As far as God Judging by himself, there are very few Scriptures which I can recall where we are told that God himself will judge, and what would that mean anyhow? would he use natural forces famine weather earthquakes but not man nor beast? We are told that some of the Judgement in Revelation is executed by sinful man.

Re 17:17 For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.

I believe that it is quite possible that in the near future that people who go into some of the new world order pentecostal churches will be struck down on the spot if they step out of line, and they will all give credit to God for Judging the Heretic.

I think the global System IS the Image to the beast, and according to Rev, it is the Image of the Beast which is given power to kill those who wont worship it, technology is such that your lap top could be used to zap you with some pretty unhelpful modulated frequencies which could attack the bodies natural electrical functionality.

For example if one was a global dissident, then it could be sorted that every time you visit certain websites or type certain things, then your screen could emit some RF which could cause depression or fuzzy thinking, or a heart attack.

Re 13:15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

I know it is far out for most people.

One problem with the RFID implant theory is inplants are not seen.  Who would know who did or did not have the mark is it is a tiny chip implanted under the skin?

 

i believe it is a physical tattoo, not a RFID chip.

It might be both, there is a tatto-chip out there, and patinted, but is needing some work for durability, the smallest chips are about .4mm the last I heard, they will be smaller now.

Edited by Old-Pilgrim
wrong word

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Eric said three things that were noteworthy in the area of the Tribulation Period. Eric is entirely correct when he said that in the end times knowledge shall increase,  that the wise shall further understand prophecy, and that the land (of Israel), will be divided for gain by the Anti-christ. Whether or not the 666 number is imprinted with an RFID or a tatoo is debateable. But, what Eric may be pointing out is that the technology is now available to mark every one on the planet with a number in order to limit the buying and selling of goods: extacly like the Bible foretold.

       1. "The RFID chip makes the mark of the beast and the ability to restrict buying and selling possible.

       Yes satellites and TV and internet make viewing the two witnesses possible.

       Technology has increased knowledge as Daniel 12:4 foretold.

       Cars, airplanes, rockets, and fuels have man running to and fro as Daniel 12:4 foretold." 

 

 Eric later mentioned that the number 666 can be applied by either the RFID chip or a tatoo.

      2. "Daniel was told that the prophecy was sealed till the time of the end but at the time of the end the wise shall understand read Daniel 12:4,10."

     3. Daniel 11:39, Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain."

Thank you Eric for bringing out these three items for us to ponder over and discuss. I appreciate your hard and diligent work in the matter of bringing our scriptures in the study of the end times. We may not always agree on some particulars but I do enjoy your postings and it makes me to think. Please keep up the good work.

Alan

Edited by Alan
spelling

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Can any tribulation be greater than that suffered by the church over the centuries?

Paulicians  -  Wiped out

Bogomils  -  Wiped out

Waldensians  -  Almost wiped out and ceased to be a witnessing entity having agreed to take the mass once a year until after the reformation.

Hussites  -  Wiped out

Huegenots  -  Wiped out. They were at one time estimated to be about 48% of the French population.

Camisards  -  Wiped out,

They are only those that I can think of at present

The end of What?  You should ask yourself.

1Pe 4:7 But the end of all things is at hand: be ye therefore sober, and watch unto prayer.

If their is a Judgement day for the wicked and a different one fro the righteous, that would be a few thousand years at least, I think it is possible that the above mentioned Tribulation could be the longest part  of 'Great Tribulation' mentioned by Jesus. One thing which stuck in my mind about some of the tribulation in church history is that some of them had the flesh cut away completely exposing the bone from the lower jaw, before they were burned alive. having a government which orders thousands of blood thirsty thugs to go and kill any and all Christians they could find, and thinking they were doing God a favour, this would be about as bad as it could get for earth dwellers.

Re 22:10 And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand.

I think the point I took from the Daniel passage about sealing the book is that their IS a progressive revelation of the Scripture by the spirit, and it is true that the early church never understood some of the things which we can understand now. The Church is to follow and grow in the knowledge of God.

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Yes. And obviously you didn't read mine. The book was not opened to the 83rd Psalm. So there is no warning from God.

Try reading Psalm 84 and getting that 'message'. It don't work.

Since there is no comment from Eric, let this be said from me.

There is no truth to most of Eric's thinking on the various subjects he posts about, and he has grabbed onto someone else's teachings on various things and believes them without any source for proof (that is scriptural) and is not acknowledging the truth about my proof from the National Geographic story about an ancient book opened to Psalm 83, which is really Psalm 84 in the KJV.

Read it and you will agree, it's not prophetic to Israel.

His teachings add up to 'conspiratorial' type exciting non-truths.

Edited by Genevanpreacher

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Genevanpreacher,

I must beg to differ. Even thouth Eric says some far off ideas on occasion to say that his teachings add up to, 'conspiratorial' type exciting non-truths is not the case. Due to the fact he is primarily talking about the 7 year Tribulation Period ( which some of the brethren here on OnLine do not believe), his thoughts are of course open up for discussion and sometimes does seen unusual. But, to try and belittle him personally by calling him 'conspiratial,' is, in my opinion, not correct. Some of his teachings is interesting and I think we need to at least listen to his thoughts.

Alan

 

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Covenanter,

If you read my post carefully I puposely addressed it the, "Brethren," as I tried to keep personalities out of the short study.  I puposely did not mention any names in order to try and keep peace among the brethren. As Isaiah 25 was brought up by Eric I felt it was appropriate to respond as I did. I purposely tried to just give the correct spiritual interpretation of Isaiah 25:6-12 and 1 Peter 1:9-13. In my opinion, I think both you and Eric missed the boat on the complete interpretation of Isaiah 25:6-12 and 1 Peter 1:9-13

Please look at the words, "partially." Ian, if you read it carefully you will notice that I partially agreed with you; and still do. 

As this thread is Eric's, and I do not want to distrupt his thread any further with my comments. So, I do not think it appropriate to comment on your comments to my post.

Brethren,

Although I do not plan on commenting on the comments of Covenanter's reply to my post I think it is a good study as it stands and do not think I need to change anything.

EKSmith,

Thank you very much for enjoying the short study on Isaiah 25:6-12 and 1 Peter 1:9-13. It is a blessing to me to know that the Lord blessed it.

In Christ,

Alan

 

I can't find a 7 year tribulation in scripture. Perhaps you can show me where it is mentioned?

 

I can only findone place where a tribulation is given a period of time and that is:

Re 2:10  Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.

Edited by Invicta
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I can't find a 7 year tribulation in scripture. Perhaps you can show me where it is mentioned?

 

I can only findone place where a tribulation is given a period of time and that is:

Re 2:10  Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.

Can I echo Invicta's question and statement, I have never seen any time period applied to any tribulation in scripture either. apart from Rev 2:10

Edited by Old-Pilgrim

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By the way, the word 'Conspiracy' wasn't invented by the illuminate and overused as a smoke screen to cover up a conspiracy. Conspiracy has always been around.

2Sa 15:12 And Absalom sent for Ahithophel the Gilonite, David's counseller, from his city, even from Giloh, while he offered sacrifices. And the conspiracy was strong; for the people increased continually with Absalom.

2Ki 12:20 And his servants arose, and made a conspiracy, and slew Joash in the house of Millo, which goeth down to Silla.

2Ki 14:19 Now they made a conspiracy against him in Jerusalem: and he fled to Lachish; but they sent after him to Lachish, and slew him there.

2Ki 15:15 And the rest of the acts of Shallum, and his conspiracy which he made, behold, they are written in the book of the chronicles of the kings of Israel.

2Ki 15:30 And Hoshea the son of Elah made a conspiracy against Pekah the son of Remaliah, and smote him, and slew him, and reigned in his stead, in the twentieth year of Jotham the son of Uzziah.

2Ki 17:4 And the king of Assyria found conspiracy in Hoshea: for he had sent messengers to So king of Egypt, and brought no present to the king of Assyria, as he had done year by year: therefore the king of Assyria shut him up, and bound him in prison.

2Ch 25:27 Now after the time that Amaziah did turn away from following the LORD they made a conspiracy against him in Jerusalem; and he fled to Lachish: but they sent to Lachish after him, and slew him there.

Jer 11:9 And the LORD said unto me, A conspiracy is found among the men of Judah, and among the inhabitants of Jerusalem.

Eze 22:25 There is a conspiracy of her prophets in the midst thereof, like a roaring lion ravening the prey; they have devoured souls; they have taken the treasure and precious things; they have made her many widows in the midst thereof.

Ac 23:13 And they were more than forty which had made this conspiracy.

 

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Old-Pilgrim,

I entirely agree with you with both your examples of conspirators. My contention was that I do not feel that Eric is one of them. We may or may agree with him and his writings, but, I see no need to slander him by calling him a conspiratist; or, demeaning him in any way.

Eric is a fine, sincere, Christian gentleman who is trying to teach the scriptures the best he can. And, in a lot of areas he is correct; speciafically concerning the Tribulation period. Eric has received a lot of grief, undue criticism, from some of the brethren on OnLine Baptist because of his correct interpretation of the 7 Year Tribulation Period. It is the criticism of his character, being called a conspiratist, that I disagreed with in the above post.

Invicta and Old-Pilgrim,

This is Eric's thread. For me to do a study on the Tribulation period, or more  correctly called in the scriptures, "the time of Jacob's trouble," (Jeremiah 31:7 and 24), in his thread is not appropriate. The study would be intensive and not short. Why not ask Eric. Eric seems knowledgeable in this area and I would like to hear his teachings on the 7 Year Tribulation Period, or, the time of Jacob's trouble.

I did touch briefly on,  "the time of Jacob's trouble," during the Revelation chapter 19-22 Study. Here is the link to that brief section: http://www.onlinebaptist.com/home/topic/23115-revelation-chapter-19-22-study/?page=1

Alan

 

Edited by Alan
repeated word

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7 year tribulation

Revelation chapter 11 explains that the ministry of the two witnesses is finished after 1260 days a the end of the second woe which is the 6th trumpet judgment. That is the first half of the 7 years. At the blowing of the 7th trumpet the kingdoms of this world become the kingdoms of God and Jesus after they defeat the devil and his angels and cast him to the earth where he will persecute Israel for a times, time and half a time or 3.5 years Revelation 12:13-14.That is the last half of the 7 years.

 

Edited by Eric Stahl

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Genevanpreacher,

I must beg to differ. Even thouth Eric says some far off ideas on occasion to say that his teachings add up to, 'conspiratorial' type exciting non-truths is not the case. Due to the fact he is primarily talking about the 7 year Tribulation Period ( which some of the brethren here on OnLine do not believe), his thoughts are of course open up for discussion and sometimes does seen unusual. But, to try and belittle him personally by calling him 'conspiratial,' is, *in my opinion, not correct. Some of his teachings is interesting and I think we need to at least listen to his thoughts.

Alan

 

It is personal. And I am not belittling him, he does that enough himself, I was just pointing out that fact. But thank you anyway for your *'opinion'.

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Since there is no comment from Eric, let this be said from me.

There is no truth to most of Eric's thinking on the various subjects he posts about, and he has grabbed onto someone else's teachings on various things and believes them without any source for proof (that is scriptural) and is not acknowledging the truth about my proof from the National Geographic story about an ancient book opened to Psalm 83, which is really Psalm 84 in the KJV.

Read it and you will agree, it's not prophetic to Israel.

His teachings add up to 'conspiratorial' type exciting non-truths.

If you would like to see the scriptures that cause me to understand end time prophecy check out my book on amazon. It is called "America's Last Warning" by Eric E Stahl. You will probably be very entertained.

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If you would like to see the scriptures that cause me to understand end time prophecy check out my book on amazon. It is called "America's Last Warning" by Eric E Stahl. You will probably be very entertained.

:lol: I couldn't help but laugh; I know you probably didn't mean it that way, but this sounds just like so many TV preachers who raise a point and then tell everyone to buy their book (or send a large donation and they'll send the book "free") if they want to know what they mean.:rolleyes:

On a more serious note, I've read many books, articles and heard sermons on this subject (some even with the same name) over the decades and they all share one thing in common: they are all filled with the authors opinions about how they have some special understanding or wisdom or revelation on the verses they cite.

Another rather common point is thus far most all of them have been shown to be either entirely or at least partly wrong.

Where are the books and sermons on Japan's last warning and Brazil's last warning and India's last warning and China's last warning and Kenya's last warning and such for the other nations?

Scripture doesn't present America as some special nation holding the key to prophetic end time events yet so many prophecy preachers and authors put forth such.

 

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:lol: I couldn't help but laugh; I know you probably didn't mean it that way, but this sounds just like so many TV preachers who raise a point and then tell everyone to buy their book (or send a large donation and they'll send the book "free") if they want to know what they mean.:rolleyes:

On a more serious note, I've read many books, articles and heard sermons on this subject (some even with the same name) over the decades and they all share one thing in common: they are all filled with the authors opinions about how they have some special understanding or wisdom or revelation on the verses they cite.

Another rather common point is thus far most all of them have been shown to be either entirely or at least partly wrong.

Where are the books and sermons on Japan's last warning and Brazil's last warning and India's last warning and China's last warning and Kenya's last warning and such for the other nations?

Scripture doesn't present America as some special nation holding the key to prophetic end time events yet so many prophecy preachers and authors put forth such.

 

I know how this will sound, when Daniel said at the time of the end the wise will understand, it meant that books written before the understanding were at a disadvantage.

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I know how this will sound, when Daniel said at the time of the end the wise will understand, it meant that books written before the understanding were at a disadvantage.

According to Brother Wretched these books aren't good and we should only read Scripture and listen to sermons. Along these lines, how do we have decades worth of books with the authors claiming to have this latter day wisdom yet their books are wholly or partly proven false already?

Does God only give a limited few, a special elect group, understanding of the end times? How do we reconcile the many prophecy preachers and authors who claim to have this special revelation today yet their revelations are not the same?

How does your understanding and book fit into this puzzle?

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According to Brother Wretched these books aren't good and we should only read Scripture and listen to sermons. Along these lines, how do we have decades worth of books with the authors claiming to have this latter day wisdom yet their books are wholly or partly proven false already?

Does God only give a limited few, a special elect group, understanding of the end times? How do we reconcile the many prophecy preachers and authors who claim to have this special revelation today yet their revelations are not the same?

How does your understanding and book fit into this puzzle?

Obviously when trying to understand prophecy we should also understand history as prophecy is history written in advance.  If we don't read history we cannot know if prophecy is fulfilled or still to be fulfilled.  There are those, like the Brethren, who blind their followers by teaching them that there is no prophecy being fulfilled, or to be fulfilled in the so called 'church age.'  They say this age is a parenthesis, not included in prophecy.  How sad, how foolish.  The church is God's master plan.  

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7 year tribulation

Revelation chapter 11 explains that the ministry of the two witnesses is finished after 1260 days a the end of the second woe which is the 6th trumpet judgment. That is the first half of the 7 years. At the blowing of the 7th trumpet the kingdoms of this world become the kingdoms of God and Jesus after they defeat the devil and his angels and cast him to the earth where he will persecute Israel for a times, time and half a time or 3.5 years Revelation 12:13-14.That is the last half of the 7 years.

 

Eric,

Thank you very much for this scriptual explanation of the of the 7 year Tribulation Period and the proper interpretation of the division of the two segments: 3 and a half years. I appreciate your labor, knowledge, and willingness to teach the correct interpretation of the Book of Revelation. As the Lord leads you, I want to encourage you to continue your exposition of the Book of Revelation and the 7 year Tribulation Period.

May the Lord Jesus be with you.

Alan

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Can I echo Invicta's question and statement, I have never seen any time period applied to any tribulation in scripture either. apart from Rev 2:10

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Revelation chapter 11 explains that the ministry of the two witnesses is finished after 1260 days a the end of the 6th trumpet judgment. That is the first half of the 7 years. At the blowing of the 7th trumpet the kingdoms of this world become the kingdoms of God and Jesus after they defeat the devil and his angels and cast him to the earth where he will persecute Israel for a times, time and half a time or 3.5 years Revelation 12:13-14.That is the last half of the 7 years.

 

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Does this help?

Revelation chapter 11 explains that the ministry of the two witnesses is finished after 1260 days a the end of the 6th trumpet judgment. That is the first half of the 7 years. At the blowing of the 7th trumpet the kingdoms of this world become the kingdoms of God and Jesus after they defeat the devil and his angels and cast him to the earth where he will persecute Israel for a times, time and half a time or 3.5 years Revelation 12:13-14.That is the last half of the 7 years.

 

Have you ever studied the symbolism of the two witnesses?  

3 ¶  And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth. 4  These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

Candlesticks represent churches. 

Re 1:12  And I turned to see the voice that spake with me. And being turned, I saw seven golden candlesticks;
Re 1:13  And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle.
Re 1:20  The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.
Re 2:1  Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write; These things saith he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks;
Re 11:4  These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

Candlesticks represent churches.

Olive Trees:?

Zec 4:1 ¶  And the angel that talked with me came again, and waked me, as a man that is wakened out of his sleep,
2  And said unto me, What seest thou? And I said, I have looked, and behold a candlestick all of gold, with a bowl upon the top of it, and his seven lamps thereon, and seven pipes to the seven lamps, which are upon the top thereof:
3  And two olive trees by it, one upon the right side of the bowl, and the other upon the left side thereof.
4  So I answered and spake to the angel that talked with me, saying, What are these, my lord?
5  Then the angel that talked with me answered and said unto me, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
6  Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the LORD unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the LORD of hosts.


7  Who art thou, O great mountain? before Zerubbabel thou shalt become a plain: and he shall bring forth the headstone thereof with shoutings, crying, Grace, grace unto it.
8  Moreover the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
9  The hands of Zerubbabel have laid the foundation of this house; his hands shall also finish it; and thou shalt know that the LORD of hosts hath sent me unto you.
10  For who hath despised the day of small things? for they shall rejoice, and shall see the plummet in the hand of Zerubbabel with those seven; they are the eyes of the LORD, which run to and fro through the whole earth.
11 ¶  Then answered I, and said unto him, What are these two olive trees upon the right side of the candlestick and upon the left side thereof?
12  And I answered again, and said unto him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves?
13  And he answered me and said, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
14  Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth.

 

In the Continuous Historical interpretation, the seven Candlesticks represent the whole church. seven being the number of completeness. The two witnesses or candlesticks represent churches in their most depleted state in the dark ages of the great tribulation on the church.  the seven Candlesticks represent the whole church.   The two olive trees represent the anointed ministers or pastors fed with thye oil of the Holy Spirit.

Edited by Invicta
Correction

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I've only heard a very few Baptists who preach this view (the view Invicta posted) or something similar.

Most Baptist pastors, here in the States anyway, preach a pre-trib rapture view, with the a mid-trib rapture view probably a distant second and any other view in the small minority.

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