Sunday School Teacher

[Guest Michael]

I believe that Jesus is the Christ and that one must confess Him and believe on His name to be saved.  I have done these things myself and have found great peace through doing so.  At the same time I have a question that I hope you can answer.  Why does God create people and place them in areas where they will never hear about Jesus Christ?  If He created them in such an environment he is creating them to inherit Hell for all eternity for they have not confessed or believed on the name of Jesus Christ.  I have struggled with this question, knowing in my heart and soul that God is a God of justice that He is a fair God.  We also read this in scripture Romans 2:11 “For there is no respect of persons with God.” Revelation 15:3, “And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, Great and marvellous are thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, thou King of saints.” Acts 10:34, “Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:” As these scriptures state and as I believe God is just and fair.  Why then does God allow His creations to inherit Hell, eternal suffering, without first giving them a chance to chose to believe on Christ name and confess Him?

[Genevanpreacher]

Considering this set of verses, we must conclude that, only them who 'receive' him into their lives and societies have that promise that IF they would believe in Jesus Christ with all their heart that they would receive salvation. If a country has not 'received' the word of God amongst their people, there is no chance for that people as a society. Unless, that is, a missionary is received in and amongst the people there. As for the Lord 'creating them and placing them', He hasn't created anyone for about 6,000 years, unless you want to consider the body he 'made' in the womb of Mary. So I don't see the Lord creating and placing people where they won't hear the gospel anyway. Every nation under heaven has heard the gospel, they just neglected the seriousness of denying the gospel when it did come into their borders, and it no longer exists in some societies now. It's not God's fault.

12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God,even to them that believe on his name:

13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

I do not believe that God created anyone and put them in an unreachable place.

 

God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son.  That Son, after His death, burial and resurrection, gave instruction to all His Apostles to go into all the world, preaching the Gospel to every creature.  He didn't say 'some creatures,' He said "all creatures."  

 

All have the knowledge that there is a creator.  See Romans 1.  Nature itself testifies that God exists.  Therefore, everyone, even in those alleged 'unreachable areas,' knows that God exists.  Perhaps, they are in those seemingly 'unreachable areas' by choice, hoping like those mentioned in Romans 1, to to replace God with their own inventions.  See psalm 106:39.

[Saintnow]

I believe that Jesus is the Christ and that one must confess Him and believe on His name to be saved.  I have done these things myself and have found great peace through doing so.  At the same time I have a question that I hope you can answer.  Why does God create people and place them in areas where they will never hear about Jesus Christ?  If He created them in such an environment he is creating them to inherit Hell for all eternity for they have not confessed or believed on the name of Jesus Christ.  I have struggled with this question, knowing in my heart and soul that God is a God of justice that He is a fair God.  We also read this in scripture Romans 2:11 “For there is no respect of persons with God.” Revelation 15:3, “And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, Great and marvellous are thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, thou King of saints.” Acts 10:34, “Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:” As these scriptures state and as I believe God is just and fair.  Why then does God allow His creations to inherit Hell, eternal suffering, without first giving them a chance to chose to believe on Christ name and confess Him?

Your question is accusatory against God.  You need to start with the assumption that your understanding is faulty and God is not, then try to figure it out in accordance to the word of God.  The answer is in the book, but if your heart is not right and you are not believing, trusting God as He is, then you will continue in error and never see that your questions are answered in the Bible.  I could show you the passages, but you would probalbly reject the teaching since your heart is not right in the matter to start with.

 

The questions you are asking in rhetorical fashion are accusations against God used by atheists and promoted by Calvinists.  Your view of God is skewed in this.  Some of the know-it-alls you encounter may not like the way I am answering so pointedly and accurately according to your own words, but that is their problem. Your problem is that you are asking a question based on a lie, the lie being that God creates people to inherit Hell...a Calvinistic lie used by atheists to imply God is not good.

The questioner says "I believe God is just and fair", then asks a question with rhetoric which accuses God of not being fair for not giving people a chance to be saved before they "inherit Hell".  It's a lie.   If they are in Hell, they had a chance to be saved from it.  The "why" of the question is unanswerable because the lie in the rhetoric precludes the answer.  It is a deceived heart holding onto a lie.  If the questioner has not stopped accusing God of creating people so they can inherit Hell, after all the scripture posted here, I stand where I started saying the question is a false accusation against God being asked out of a deceived heart....the problem is a heart problem of a person who wants to blame God for some things he does not like.   I don't like the fact that people are burning in Hell because I know I deserve to be one of them....but I'm sure not going to blame God for those who don't get saved from it.

Edited July 15, 2015 by Saintnow

[John81]

If the question is sincere, it's not an accusation against God. God doesn't fear our questions since He has the perfect answer for each one. It's not uncommon at all for many saved folks, along with many unsaved folks, to wonder how an Indian living in the jungles of South America (for instance) cut off from civilization can know of God or have any hope of salvation.

As pointed to above, Romans 1 addresses this. God speaks to all people through His creation. Some respond with a sincere desire to know The Creator, while most don't. Those who do recognize The Creator must exist and desires to know Him, God will make a way. This could take many forms, perhaps the Indian somehow stumbles upon civilization and contact with those who will eventually share Christ with him...perhaps God will direct a missionary to him...or use some other means.

No one, regardless of where they are on the planet are out of reach of God's revelation of Himself. Sadly, only few are willing to accept what God shows and strive to know Him. Nevertheless, the opportunity is there for all.

[Jordan Kurecki]

Ever wondered about people who die and never hear the gospel? What happens to them?
Rom 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: 
Rom 1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. 
Rom 1:22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, 
Rom 1:23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. 
Rom 1:24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: 
Rom 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

Notice here that God and his power are CLEARLY SEEN,BEING UNDERSTOOD, by the things that are made (Creation).

So God and his existence are clearly seen by looking at creation, for example the complexity of life, the vastness of the universe, the amazing laws of nature, these all point to an omnipotent God in the same way a 2014 Camaro point to that manufacturer.

This is called General Revelation, and it is the first revelation God gives to a man.

Everyone knows this at some point, the passage say that when they knew God they glorified him not as God, so they rejected God, usually because of the responsibility to him that this would bring, it's easier to deny God than to be responsible to him for out actions, because of this denial they end up in a downward spiral in all sorts of wicked depraved sins, and they usually end up in false religions as well, the passage talks about exchanging the truth of God into a lie, basically people create their own concept of God that does not exist, Pantheism and Polytheism are a good example of this.

Another revelation of God is the conscience:
Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: 
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another

everyone knows deep down inside that lying, murder, stealing, etc are wrong, and this is written on man's heart in his conscience.
The point i am making is if a person refuses to accept the revelation of Creation, and the Revelation of Conscience, then God is not obligated to give the revelation of Christ, this is completely just and fair.If a person is not willing to learn simply addition and subtraction then it is not unjust for the teacher to be unwilling to teach him calculus.

God sends missionaries when he knows there are people who will be receptive.he is all knowing and knows who will accept his gift of eternal life.
People do not deserve to go to heaven because of sin, it is completely just for God to send anyone to hell,without them ever hearing the gospel, because all have sinned and chosen to do wrong in life. this includes people in foreign lands, When God allows sinners to have a chance to hear the gospel, that is called grace, because they do not deserve the chance, But I do believe that if there is anyone who would be willing to get saved, God will in fact allow them to hear the message somehow, the bible says that God is "not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.", the bible also says that he wills all men to come the knowledge of the truth and wills all men to be saved. Jesus also said that if he be lifted up (referring to the cross) that he will draw all men to himself; this shows that to some degree, God draws all men to Christ, to the degree that a person is willing to let God draw him, he will draw them.

Consider this passage from the bible:
Act 8:26 And the angel of the Lord spake unto Philip, saying, Arise, and go toward the south unto the way that goeth down from Jerusalem unto Gaza, which is desert. 
Act 8:27 And he arose and went: and, behold, a man of Ethiopia, an eunuch of great authority under Candace queen of the Ethiopians, who had the charge of all her treasure, and had come to Jerusalem for to worship, 
Act 8:28 Was returning, and sitting in his chariot read Esaias the prophet. 
Act 8:29 Then the Spirit said unto Philip, Go near, and join thyself to this chariot. 
Act 8:30 And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest? 
Act 8:31 And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him. 
Act 8:32 The place of the scripture which he read was this, He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and like a lamb dumb before his shearer, so opened he not his mouth: 
Act 8:33 In his humiliation his judgment was taken away: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken from the earth. 
Act 8:34 And the eunuch answered Philip, and said, I pray thee, of whom speaketh the prophet this? of himself, or of some other man? 
Act 8:35 Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus. 
Act 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? 
Act 8:37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. 
Act 8:38 And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him. 
Act 8:39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.

Notice here is Eunuch reading the old testament scripture who is clearly searching for the truth, so God sends him somebody to explain to him about Jesus.
Consider another example:

Act 16:9 And a vision appeared to Paul in the night; There stood a man of Macedonia, and prayed him, saying, Come over into Macedonia, and help us. 
Act 16:10 And after he had seen the vision, immediately we endeavoured to go into Macedonia, assuredly gathering that the Lord had called us for to preach the gospel unto them.

Hope this helps you to understand.

[Ukulelemike]

I knew of a man born in Nepal, in a small village, secluded from most outside contact. He was born into a priestly family, and destined to be the high priest of their particular sect of religion. He was raised up with this in mind, and all his training reflected those beliefs-he knew nothing else.  And yet, as he considered the earth around him, he began to believe there was something wrong with what he was being told, though again, he knew of no other ways. yet it continued in him and so be eventually left his home to try to find what he was looking for. As he went through his country, he came across muslims, Catholics and Buddhists. and investigated their religions, but wasn't satisfied. Over time, he eventually came to America and began to investigate some religions, and ended up in a, Independent Baptist church, and there, he said, he found rest in his heart, was born again, and eventually became a missionary to his people back in Nepal.

This is a true story-and it is an example of how God puts the knowledge of Himself in all men, no matter where they are. John says that Jesus lightens all men who come into the world, and this is an example of just that: he saw the light and even in his darkened condition, he reached for that light, and sought it diligently until the Lord led him to where he would come to know Him, and he was saved.

[Invicta]

Your question is accusatory against God.  You need to start with the assumption that your understanding is faulty and God is not, then try to figure it out in accordance to the word of God.  The answer is in the book, but if your heart is not right and you are not believing, trusting God as He is, then you will continue in error and never see that your questions are answered in the Bible.  I could show you the passages, but you would probalbly reject the teaching since your heart is not right in the matter to start with.

 

The questions you are asking in rhetorical fashion are accusations against God used by atheists and promoted by Calvinists.  Your view of God is skewed in this.  

What a strange post.  

I have no doubt that there are many in every country who have never heard the gospel of salvation through through faith in the risen saviour.  Including the USA, GB, EU and any country you could name.  Many probably sit in a church every week and never hear the gospel preached,  I think it was Paris Reidhead who said something like "I went to Africa because I thought the natives didn't turn to Christ because they had never heard of him.  I was wrong, they didn't turn to Christ because they loved their sins."

[Saintnow]

What a strange post.  

I have no doubt that there are many in every country who have never heard the gospel of salvation through through faith in the risen saviour.  Including the USA, GB, EU and any country you could name.  Many probably sit in a church every week and never hear the gospel preached,  I think it was Paris Reidhead who said something like "I went to Africa because I thought the natives didn't turn to Christ because they had never heard of him.  I was wrong, they didn't turn to Christ because they loved their sins."

 " Why does God create people and place them in areas where they will never hear about Jesus Christ?  If He created them in such an environment he is creating them to inherit Hell for all eternity for they have not confessed or believed on the name of Jesus Christ."

This is the focal point I was addressing...the man is blaming God for creating people who end up in Hell, blaming God for their fate. It's a heart issue of the person who is asking the questions against God without accepting the answer He gave in His word.  You answered the rhetorical question in a Biblical fashion correctly...I declined to answer that way (though my answer is Biblical and easily supported by scripture) because it seems evident that the question is not honest.  The questioner has already concluded that it's God's fault if they end up in Hell because "he is creating them to inherit Hell for all eternity".  That is not what God created them for, the question is from  a deceived heart.  He is trying to find an answer that will agree with his skewed view of God, and will never find it.  To me, this sounds like the mind-bending questioning of Calvinism....the questioner is saying some are predestined for Hell and it's God's intention for them to inherit it.

 

That's a great quote from Paris Reidhead...even if it's not accurate, we know what it means and it's true. 

 

Edited July 15, 2015 by Saintnow

[Saintnow]

If the question is sincere, it's not an accusation against God. God doesn't fear our questions since He has the perfect answer for each one. It's not uncommon at all for many saved folks, along with many unsaved folks, to wonder how an Indian living in the jungles of South America (for instance) cut off from civilization can know of God or have any hope of salvation.

As pointed to above, Romans 1 addresses this. God speaks to all people through His creation. Some respond with a sincere desire to know The Creator, while most don't. Those who do recognize The Creator must exist and desires to know Him, God will make a way. This could take many forms, perhaps the Indian somehow stumbles upon civilization and contact with those who will eventually share Christ with him...perhaps God will direct a missionary to him...or use some other means.

No one, regardless of where they are on the planet are out of reach of God's revelation of Himself. Sadly, only few are willing to accept what God shows and strive to know Him. Nevertheless, the opportunity is there for all.

The question is indeed a rhetorical accusation against God based on a faulty view of God.  I don't think it's sincere at all.  It's an accusation against God.  If the question is sincere, you answered it well enough (other than criticizing my answer) and the questioner will take the Biblcal stand on the issue, repenting of accusing God of creating people so they can burn in Hell without any chance of being saved before they find themselves stuck there.

" Why then does God allow His creations to inherit Hell, eternal suffering, without first giving them a chance to chose to believe on Christ name and confess Him?"

This is not an honest question.  It is framed as a question but has already rejected the answer by saying God lets people be condemned in Hell forever without ever having a chance to be saved.  That is a false accusation against God, the question is rhetorical and not an honest question.    The "why" of the question is unanswerable because the rhetoric embodied in the question is a lie.   The questioner has a heart problem in which he is entertaining a lie against God....unless of course he has accepted the excellent Biblical reasoning given by you and others here from God's word, but I doubt that he has and will be happy if he proves me wrong.

 Every person who ends up in Hell had an opportunity to receive God's mercy and be saved from Hell through Jesus Christ at some time in their life.  They are without excuse and they can't blame God.

 Somehow I think this is nothing but Calvinistic propaganda, teaching predestination to Heaven or predestination to Hell. 

The heart of the matter is a heart issue of the questioner, and I see no indication of them submitting to God to accept His answer and put the blame,  of a sinner burning in Hell, on that sinner and only on that sinner.

Calvinism is a cultish heart issue that gives rise to these mind-bender questions which elevate personal feelings of the questioner above the word of God.   Let the questioner argue....it seems some are trying to argue against me while we are in agreement. 

I knew of a man born in Nepal, in a small village, secluded from most outside contact. He was born into a priestly family, and destined to be the high priest of their particular sect of religion. He was raised up with this in mind, and all his training reflected those beliefs-he knew nothing else.  And yet, as he considered the earth around him, he began to believe there was something wrong with what he was being told, though again, he knew of no other ways. yet it continued in him and so be eventually left his home to try to find what he was looking for. As he went through his country, he came across muslims, Catholics and Buddhists. and investigated their religions, but wasn't satisfied. Over time, he eventually came to America and began to investigate some religions, and ended up in a, Independent Baptist church, and there, he said, he found rest in his heart, was born again, and eventually became a missionary to his people back in Nepal.

This is a true story-and it is an example of how God puts the knowledge of Himself in all men, no matter where they are. John says that Jesus lightens all men who come into the world, and this is an example of just that: he saw the light and even in his darkened condition, he reached for that light, and sought it diligently until the Lord led him to where he would come to know Him, and he was saved.

and now maybe he can persuade some others  to repent and believe

Edited July 15, 2015 by Saintnow

[John81]

The question is indeed a rhetorical accusation against God based on a faulty view of God.  I don't think it's sincere at all.  It's an accusation against God.  If the question is sincere, you answered it well enough (other than criticizing my answer) and the questioner will take the Biblcal stand on the issue, repenting of accusing God of creating people so they can burn in Hell without any chance of being saved before they find themselves stuck there.

" Why then does God allow His creations to inherit Hell, eternal suffering, without first giving them a chance to chose to believe on Christ name and confess Him?"

This is not an honest question.  It is framed as a question but has already rejected the answer by saying God lets people be condemned in Hell forever without ever having a chance to be saved.  Every person who ends up in Hell had an opportunity to receive God's mercy and be saved from Hell through Jesus Christ at some time in their life.  They are without excuse and they can't blame God.

 Somehow I think this is nothing but Calvinistic propaganda, teaching predestination to Heaven or predestination to Hell. 

The heart of the matter is a heart issue of the questioner, and I see no indication of them submitting to God to accept His answer and put the blame,  of a sinner burning in Hell, on that sinner and only on that sinner.

Calvinism is a cultish heart issue that gives rise to these mind-bender questions which elevate personal feelings of the questioner above the word of God.   Let the questioner argue....it seems some are trying to argue against me while we are in agreement. 

There is a lot of assuming here. Judging someone to be accusing God without knowing they are is very serious. Accusing someone of asking a question because you think it might have something to do with Calvinism, without any evidence to support that, is also a problem.

True enough, a person cold ask such a question in a manner accusing God and they could do so based on some view of Calvinism; but at this point, neither of those are evident in the OP.

Most Christians aren't well grounded in Scripture and many Christians have not yet matured in their understanding of Scripture and God. It's very common to hear born again Christians asking questions of "why did God..." or "why does God allow..." and that sort of thing in a manner of sincerely wanting to know "why".

I know in my early years as a Christian I wrestled with several issues and wondered "why" and it wasn't a matter of accusing God, it was a matter of not knowing Scripture and therefore not knowing God well enough. My questions also had nothing to do with Calvinism, which I never even heard of until many years later.

We are to disciple others, something we so often fail to do, and one of the reasons some folks don't seek out such help is because they have experienced or seen others come under fire for asking sincere questions.

Our first action when asked a question of this nature should be to help the questioner by providing a biblical answer. If they receive the answer they have been blessed. If they have follow-up questions we can generally determine whether they are further attempts to grow or they are looking for argument.

[Saintnow]

There is a lot of assuming here. Judging someone to be accusing God without knowing they are is very serious. Accusing someone of asking a question because you think it might have something to do with Calvinism, without any evidence to support that, is also a problem.

True enough, a person cold ask such a question in a manner accusing God and they could do so based on some view of Calvinism; but at this point, neither of those are evident in the OP.

Most Christians aren't well grounded in Scripture and many Christians have not yet matured in their understanding of Scripture and God. It's very common to hear born again Christians asking questions of "why did God..." or "why does God allow..." and that sort of thing in a manner of sincerely wanting to know "why".

I know in my early years as a Christian I wrestled with several issues and wondered "why" and it wasn't a matter of accusing God, it was a matter of not knowing Scripture and therefore not knowing God well enough. My questions also had nothing to do with Calvinism, which I never even heard of until many years later.

We are to disciple others, something we so often fail to do, and one of the reasons some folks don't seek out such help is because they have experienced or seen others come under fire for asking sincere questions.

Our first action when asked a question of this nature should be to help the questioner by providing a biblical answer. If they receive the answer they have been blessed. If they have follow-up questions we can generally determine whether they are further attempts to grow or they are looking for argument.

You are trying to argue with the wrong person.  Why not let the questioner answer for himself?  I stand by all I said in addressing the questioner and see no reason to change my mind about it until the questioner shows they have changed their mind.   The question is common among atheists who have some knowledge of the Bible, and is Calvinistic in it's implication.  I'm not going to argue with you in this.  I'm looking for the questioner's response and I suggest that you do the same.

I stand by all I have said, and if you want to make accusations and assumptions against me, I guess God allows you to do that for now.

Edited July 15, 2015 by Saintnow

[John81]

You are trying to argue with the wrong person.  Why not let the questioner answer for himself?  I stand by all I said in addressing the questioner and see no reason to change my mind about it until the questioner shows they have changed their mind.   The question is common among atheists who have some knowledge of the Bible, and is Calvinistic in it's implication.  I'm not going to argue with you in this.  I'm looking for the questioner's response and I suggest that you do the same.

I'm not seeking to argue with anyone. You made accusations based upon assumptions. That should not be our response when asked a question. If further discussion from a person asking a question brings forth reason to question their sincerity or something to do with Calvinism, that would be the time to address such, and hopefully in a helpful manner.

As it stands, we have a question put forth that simply by reading the OP can't be categorized as 100% sincere or 100% accusatory. Since we are called to esteem others as better than ourselves, and we are to show the love of Christ, we should take the question at face value and provide an answer.

In a face-to-face discussion we can often detect intent by inflection, tone and body language but that's not available online. It's very easy to either read something into a post that's not there or to miss something. This should prompt us to be slow to speak, slow to anger; while also prompting us to be careful.

If the person is insincere and they post on, it will come out and that will be addressed. As it stands, a question many ask (both believers and unbelievers) has been asked and answered by some so at the very least guests who view this thread who may have similar questions will have answers to consider.

[Invicta]

 " Why does God create people and place them in areas where they will never hear about Jesus Christ?  If He created them in such an environment he is creating them to inherit Hell for all eternity for they have not confessed or believed on the name of Jesus Christ."

This is the focal point I was addressing...the man is blaming God for creating people who end up in Hell, blaming God for their fate. It's a heart issue of the person who is asking the questions against God without accepting the answer He gave in His word.  You answered the rhetorical question in a Biblical fashion correctly...I declined to answer that way (though my answer is Biblical and easily supported by scripture) because it seems evident that the question is not honest.  The questioner has already concluded that it's God's fault if they end up in Hell because "he is creating them to inherit Hell for all eternity".  That is not what God created them for, the question is from  a deceived heart.  He is trying to find an answer that will agree with his skewed view of God, and will never find it.  To me, this sounds like the mind-bending questioning of Calvinism....the questioner is saying some are predestined for Hell and it's God's intention for them to inherit it.

 

That's a great quote from Paris Reidhead...even if it's not accurate, we know what it means and it's true. 

 

If you are referring to my quote from Reidhead being inaccurate, I would not be surprised, I was quoting from memory.