...and all this time, I thought David killed Goliath!

[No Nicolaitans]

2 Samuel 21:19 (ESV-English Standard Version)

And there was again war with the Philistines at Gob, and Elhanan the son of Jaare-oregim, the Bethlehemite, struck down Goliath the Gittite, the shaft of whose spear was like a weaver’s beam.

...oops...wait...sorry...just ignore that last verse! After reading the dual account in 1 Chronicles 20:5, the ESV corrects its mistake.

1 Chronicles 20:5 (ESV-English Standard Version)

And there was again war with the Philistines, and Elhanan the son of Jair struck down Lahmi the brother of Goliath the Gittite, the shaft of whose spear was like a weaver’s beam.

I guess there ARE  contradictions in the...err...uhmmm..."Bible".

[Standing Firm In Christ]

Many other "Mis"-Translations also have a problem with el-hanan killing the already dead Giant.  RoFL

[Jordan Kurecki]

What if their were two Goliaths?

[No Nicolaitans]

What if their were two Goliaths?

​I don't think it's likely, but let's say that it's possible that there were two Goliaths...it is possible after all. However, the problem isn't whether there were two Goliaths; the problem is that the ESV contradicts itself in the dual account that I gave above. Many events in the Old Testament have dual accounts listed in both Kings and Chronicles. This is one of them...one can read the verses before and after, and it's obviously the same story, the same account, but they have contradictory claims. That one account alone should show people that something is wrong with modern versions.

As SFIC said, and I also checked before I posted this topic, the ESV isn't the only modern version that has this contradictory account. I could have listed the ones that I found, but I chose to use the ESV since it's so popular.

The lost world loves to claim that there are contradictions in the Bible. There are none in the King James...but there certainly are in modern versions.

[Invicta]

2Sa 21:19  And there was again a battle in Gob with the Philistines, where Elhanan the son of Jaareoregim, a Bethlehemite, slew the brother of Goliath the Gittite, the staff of whose spear was like a weaver’s beam.
1Ch 20:5  And there was war again with the Philistines; and Elhanan the son of Jair slew Lahmi the brother of Goliath the Gittite, whose spear staff was like a weaver’s beam.  KJV

In 2 Sam. the brother  is in italics shewing that it was not in the original text.

Edited May 20, 2015 by Invicta

[No Nicolaitans]

2Sa 21:19  And there was again a battle in Gob with the Philistines, where Elhanan the son of Jaareoregim, a Bethlehemite, slew the brother of Goliath the Gittite, the staff of whose spear was like a weaver’s beam.
1Ch 20:5  And there was war again with the Philistines; and Elhanan the son of Jair slew Lahmi the brother of Goliath the Gittite, whose spear staff was like a weaver’s beam.  KJV

In 2 Sam. the brother  is in italics shewing that it was not in the original text.

​Why do you think the translators added "the brother of"?

[Invicta]

​Why do you think the translators added "the brother of"?

​You are asking me to read the minds of the translators?

Words in italics were added to ma\ke sense of the reading.  

[No Nicolaitans]

Right. Sorry Invicta, I didn't mean anything by my question.

When reading what the translators said, they said that they "carefully" compared. Since they took the time to compare, I would venture to say that they must have realized that since the two accounts were the same, and since the second account gave a more detailed account than the first account, they added "the brother of" to the first account since the second account gave the detail of who Elhanan slew.

 

[DaveW]

And let's not forget that aside from the care they took in comparing Scripture with Scripture (which certain other translators did not bother with), they were also honest enough to note (by italics) that these words were added for clarity.

A thorough and also transparent process and result.

[TheSword]

While I agree with the comparison point by NN and DaveW, there's actually a little more nuance to the explanation that makes it all a little more concrete. In 1 Ch 20:5, "Goliath" is preceded by "achi" which specifies "brother of", thus "brother of Goliath" is clear. In 2 Sam 21:19, Goliath is preceded by "et". This is an untranslatable word that can is used as either a particle to designate a definite direct object (i.e. divides the subject/nominative and predicate/accusative parts of a sentence), or signify "with" or "among" for the following word.

In essence, then, what we have in 2 Sam 21:19 is probably an example of the latter that would woodenly read something like "...slew among/with Goliath the Gittite".  Here's the really cool part, 2 Samuel was written at a time when the immediate audience would be well aware of who Elhanan killed and therefore it wasn't necessary for the author to be as explicit, but rather used elliptical language. 1 Chronicles, on the other hand, was written centuries later to an audience who would not have been as immediately familiar with the events, and the author therefore needed to be explicit.

What we have in the KJV appears to be both a comparison and a faithful rendering of the text as it was intended.

[Leonard Sylvia]

The Goliath from the battle with David was from Gath, was probably another Goliath.

[TheSword]

The Goliath from the battle with David was from Gath, was probably another Goliath.

"Gittite" designates a person from Gath. While I suppose it's possible that there were two well-known giants from the same city with the same name around the same time, it seems rather unlikely.

[Genevanpreacher]

So what is proper is - that as long as someone points it out, like most study bibles do in their notes, and the KJV did in inserting in italics in the verse, that makes it just fine?

Doesn't sound like an issue then.