Jump to content
Online Baptist

Soulwinning Teens and Young people

Rate this topic


Recommended Posts

  • Replies 76
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

Potatochip, We are native Americans. Both my wife and I are from Missouri, our home chuch is in Michigan, and all except one of our children, are grown and live in the States. One of our children has

I was at an event last night May 7, 2015.  A suburban festival.  You could sample food from local restaurants.  There were about I an estimated 50k people there.  Very rare you have that many teens in

​John 3:16 - "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." These words of Jesus Christ are nonsense?!

  • Members

Why is an Old Testament verse (regarding winning souls) obscure, but another Old Testament verse (regarding God hating the wicked) not obscure when it's used to show people today that God hates them?

​What's obscure about this verse?

Ps5:

1 To the chief Musician upon Nehiloth, A Psalm of David. Give ear to my words, O LORD, consider my meditation.

2 Hearken unto the voice of my cry, my King, and my God: for unto thee will I pray.

3 My voice shalt thou hear in the morning, O LORD; in the morning will I direct my prayer unto thee, and will look up.

4 For thou art not a God that hath pleasure in wickedness: neither shall evil dwell with thee.
5 The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.
6 Thou shalt destroy them that speak leasing: the LORD will abhor the bloody and deceitful man.
7 But as for me, I will come into thy house in the multitude of thy mercy: and in thy fear will I worship toward thy holy temple.
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​What's obscure about this verse?

Ps5:

1 To the chief Musician upon Nehiloth, A Psalm of David. Give ear to my words, O LORD, consider my meditation.

2 Hearken unto the voice of my cry, my King, and my God: for unto thee will I pray.

3 My voice shalt thou hear in the morning, O LORD; in the morning will I direct my prayer unto thee, and will look up.

4 For thou art not a God that hath pleasure in wickedness: neither shall evil dwell with thee.
5 The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.
6 Thou shalt destroy them that speak leasing: the LORD will abhor the bloody and deceitful man.
7 But as for me, I will come into thy house in the multitude of thy mercy: and in thy fear will I worship toward thy holy temple.

​I didn't say it was obscure; I asked why it wasn't obscure.

You keep referring to reading Proverbs 11:30 in context...that it's contextually obscure.

Proverbs 11:30 stands on its own merit; it is alone in its context. You can't read the preceding or succeeding verses to gain any "context" for Proverbs 11:30. If you read the entire chapter, you will see that it consists of individual verses relaying wisdom in each verse; therefore, there is no actual "context" apart from what each verse is relaying. Each verse stands alone with an individual message. The context of Proverbs 11:30 is exactly what it says.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​There are several issues with the term "soulwinning".  First off, the claims that it is a Biblical term based on Proverbs 11:30: "The fruit of the righteous is a tree of life; and he that winneth souls is wise."  That verse is contextually obscure--just read it in context!  It certainly doesn't talk about a modern ministry.  So to link "soul winning" activities to a verse that most likely talks about something else is a huge stretch at best.

The other issue with the term is that it tends to give glory to men.  I've heard people say things like "he's been a champion soulwinner".  It implies that the preachers Save people, and not Grace. 

​Properly used I see no problem with the term "soul winning". Those who want to gain praise for themselves as some great soul winner have heart issues which need addressed that have nothing to do with the term.

I've heard folks who use the term "fishers of men" make claims of being the best fishers, but again, that's a sinful issue in their heart which needs addressed, not a problem with the term being used.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

And I've seen men take titles of honour to themselves as well - like "Reverend" which, while we are talking biblical terms, should only be applied to God.

That seems to me like a very prideful thing to do. And an unbiblical thing to do as well.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​Which raises the point of just where Scripture says anything even remotely related to a bus ministry.

​Go out into the highways and hedges and compel them to come in.

He that goeth forth weeping, bearing precious seed shall doubtless come again with rejoicing bringing his sheaves with him.

Pretty much all of it related to the Lord's Command is related to the bus ministry. The bus ministry is the open door ticket into countless homes with the ice already broken.

Time is getting shorter every day folks, you may want to reevaluate sitting on laurels.

And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.

I don't want to be in the "dull as mud" section of Heaven with the calvin worshippers. I want to be in the shiney section thank you very much :)

 

Edited by wretched
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Potatochip and others who have offered testimony of your Biblical witness to young people, thank you. You are setting a good Christian example for the people around you and to us through your testimony.  

Also it's too bad this thread got so derailed into yet another fruitless discussion  argument about Calvinism. And I sincerely apologize for my part in it. 

 

Edited by Li Bai Jia
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​Go out into the highways and hedges and compel them to come in.

He that goeth forth weeping, bearing precious seed shall doubtless come again with rejoicing bringing his sheaves with him.

Pretty much all of it related to the Lord's Command is related to the bus ministry. The bus ministry is the open door ticket into countless homes with the ice already broken.

Time is getting shorter every day folks, you may want to reevaluate sitting on laurels.

And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.

I don't want to be in the "dull as mud" section of Heaven with the calvin worshippers. I want to be in the shiney section thank you very much :)

 

​This is telling them to go out and make disciples (as it were) and bring them in; not to go forth and drag the lost into the home of the saved. Notice those not properly dressed (unsaved) who showed up were kicked out.

"Church" is to be the gathering of the saints (saved folks) for edification, teaching and instruction in holy living and spreading the Gospel. The saints are then to go forth share the Gospel, bringing those who hear and receive into the gathering of believers. 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Li Bai Jia,  Thank you so much for the compliment.  Every once and a while in the street I get someone that compliments the work I do for the Kingdom of God.  I am so busy.  At those times.  I have to say thank you quickly and move on.  

I actually got this idea for reaching young people from a much older woman.  In her 70s I believe.  It was at lunch with 2 other ladies.  They had invited me to lunch after services.  She had said mentioned just how open that young people are.  That reaching them while they are young is a fairly easy thing to do.  I figure as a grandmother. She just might know what she is talking about.  Sure enough handing out tracts.  They were reading them.  Young people are just getting acclimated to being social in the world.  I recognized all those things and thought what a wonderful idea.  I have her to thank for it I really do.  Of course Jesus Christ who brought us together. 

Edited by Potatochip
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​If this statement isn't Calvinistic, I don't know what is. <_<

​That depends upon which way one chooses to look at it. Many anti-cals say the same thing, it's just a matter of their perspective of "why" being different from the cals.

The non-cal says anyone saved is of the elect and they are elect because they chose to be born again in Christ.

While the cal says anyone saved is of the elect and they are elect because God specifically chose them to be born again at that specific time.

The saved person is viewed as one of the elect by both the cal and non-cal, but each holds a very different view as to the how and why the saved is one of the elect.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​That depends upon which way one chooses to look at it. Many anti-cals say the same thing, it's just a matter of their perspective of "why" being different from the cals.

The non-cal says anyone saved is of the elect and they are elect because they chose to be born again in Christ.

While the cal says anyone saved is of the elect and they are elect because God specifically chose them to be born again at that specific time.

The saved person is viewed as one of the elect by both the cal and non-cal, but each holds a very different view as to the how and why the saved is one of the elect.

​This is pretty reasonable but misses the real point.

The biggest difference is the fruit each type bears. The fruit of the righteous is a tree of life and he that winneth souls is wise.

The calvin worshippers worship his ideas because it justifies their laziness and lack of witnessing in their own hearts. Face it folks, witnessing is the by far the hardest thing we can do and the only thing that counts in Jesus' opinion and if you want that backed by Scripture, start at Genesis and finish at Revelation.

The only reason anyone turns their ear to this calvin rubbish is because its relieves their fleshly desire to do nothing for God.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​This is pretty reasonable but misses the real point.

The biggest difference is the fruit each type bears. The fruit of the righteous is a tree of life and he that winneth souls is wise.

The calvin worshippers worship his ideas because it justifies their laziness and lack of witnessing in their own hearts. Face it folks, witnessing is the by far the hardest thing we can do and the only thing that counts in Jesus' opinion and if you want that backed by Scripture, start at Genesis and finish at Revelation.

The only reason anyone turns their ear to this calvin rubbish is because its relieves their fleshly desire to do nothing for God.

 

​Actually, I made my point. You are addressing another point, which is fine too. The only point I was speaking to was that we all believe the saved are elect. It's the how and why which we differ on, which those questions are the beginning of the point you wanted to address.

To another point, I've never yet met one of these "calvin worshippers". I've also never met a cal that didn't believe in witnessing.

Previously you asked about a website for a cal Bap church I mentioned to which I have found out they have none. I was sent some recordings of a few sermons and the most recent one I listened to had the pastor, a cal, talking about how whosoever believes shall be saved and it's our (Christians) duty to take the Gospel to the lost and to witness at every opportunity. This is in line with cal preachers such as Edwards, Whitefield, Spurgeon, Mueller and others.

One of the reasons some folks don't listen to anti-cals is because of the way they deliver their arguments against cals. They hear all sorts of charges but then when they investigate in person they find so many of the charges weren't true they are more open to give the cals a more attentive ear.

This is similar to the old hype against doing marijuana when they used to warn of outrageous effects that even a puff of a joint could cause but when some tried a puff to see if it was true or not, and found out it wasn't, they determined there was nothing to worry about and smoked on.

When dealing with the cal issue it's so much better to stick with the biblical points than to use hyperbole, argue about Calvin (which many cals know little or nothing about anyway), or to try and tell them what they think. Speak the Scripture, let the Holy Ghost do His work.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Members

To another point, I've never yet met one of these "calvin worshippers".

​I have.  Had to rebuke a pastor in his own church over this.  So what?  Yes, there are those that take Calvin's writings as gospel.  That doesn't invalidate the TULIP.

Speak the Scripture, let the Holy Ghost do His work.

Indeed!

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

No, what invalidates TULIP is that it is unbiblical.

It misuses and redefines biblical terms. 

Calvin was unsaved man who examined the Bible as a book of law, then created his own version of Catholicism with him as the leader,  and then ruled that religion by fear and threatenings. 

Those who follow this wicked man,  follow the ravings of a man opposed to God and opposed to God's Word.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​Actually, I made my point. You are addressing another point, which is fine too. The only point I was speaking to was that we all believe the saved are elect. It's the how and why which we differ on, which those questions are the beginning of the point you wanted to address.

To another point, I've never yet met one of these "calvin worshippers". I've also never met a cal that didn't believe in witnessing.

Previously you asked about a website for a cal Bap church I mentioned to which I have found out they have none. I was sent some recordings of a few sermons and the most recent one I listened to had the pastor, a cal, talking about how whosoever believes shall be saved and it's our (Christians) duty to take the Gospel to the lost and to witness at every opportunity. This is in line with cal preachers such as Edwards, Whitefield, Spurgeon, Mueller and others.

One of the reasons some folks don't listen to anti-cals is because of the way they deliver their arguments against cals. They hear all sorts of charges but then when they investigate in person they find so many of the charges weren't true they are more open to give the cals a more attentive ear.

This is similar to the old hype against doing marijuana when they used to warn of outrageous effects that even a puff of a joint could cause but when some tried a puff to see if it was true or not, and found out it wasn't, they determined there was nothing to worry about and smoked on.

When dealing with the cal issue it's so much better to stick with the biblical points than to use hyperbole, argue about Calvin (which many cals know little or nothing about anyway), or to try and tell them what they think. Speak the Scripture, let the Holy Ghost do His work.

​Interesting response John but still no website demonstrating both calvin doctrine and real soulwinning ministries. I suspect if you can't find it, it isn't out there. 

I would certainly consider your defense of calvin worship if you could find just one and post it.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist
 

​I have.  Had to rebuke a pastor in his own church over this.  So what?  Yes, there are those that take Calvin's writings as gospel.  That doesn't invalidate the TULIP.

Indeed!

​I don't doubt such exists, I've simply never encountered any in person, only online.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​Interesting response John but still no website demonstrating both calvin doctrine and real soulwinning ministries. I suspect if you can't find it, it isn't out there. 

I would certainly consider your defense of calvin worship if you could find just one and post it.

​I'm not looking for websites that defend cal or demonstrate anything. You had asked about a specific church to which I pointed out they have no website.

If you are interested in soul winning cals you can read Edwards, Whitefield, Spurgeon and Mueller; all of which were cals and all were soul winners.

Every call I've ever met in person looks to Scripture as their source, not Calvin. They all point to Paul as their main source for their views. As far as I can recall, they say Augustine was the first to write some about this subject and later Calvin gave attention to trying to put in writing what they claim was the view of the Apostle Paul and Christians for centuries prior to Calvin. Calvin, they will point out, didn't originate anything, he simply tried to write it out.

In any event, there are dozens of books revealing well known cals who were soul winners, as well as cal missions organizations if you wish to pursue such.

These days I only see a handful of churches of any kind doing much towards soul winning. Most Christians seem to do nothing and many of those who are more active are presenting a watered down "gospel" and/or they push people to say a "sinners prayer", then they tell them they are going to heaven, write down another mark in their record book so they can tell everyone how many souls they've saved yet neither their church nor any others around ever have these supposed new Christians entering their doors.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

No John, you are wrong.

They SAY they don't look to Calvin,  but they reference his writings and in fact some of them "reverence" his writings.

I have had it said to me that "It is a pity that Calvin didn't write about Revelation, because then we could understand it".

These were the very words from a man in the Dutch reformed church here in my city, and they are Calvinist through and through, and hold to many other false doctrines, such as replacement  theology, infant baptism, and the like - all by the way supported from Calvin's institutes.

As well as this, many of your so called calvinists either have been wrongly claimed by the calvinist mobs to try to bolster their position, or like Spurgeon, they were schizophrenic Calvinists who held to a dual position of calvinistic election and total free will of men.

You have been told this before but still insist on adding Spurgeon's name automatically to the list at every opportunity.

It shows poor research and poor understanding of the man and his position.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

No John, you are wrong.

They SAY they don't look to Calvin,  but they reference his writings and in fact some of them "reverence" his writings.

I have had it said to me that "It is a pity that Calvin didn't write about Revelation, because then we could understand it".

These were the very words from a man in the Dutch reformed church here in my city, and they are Calvinist through and through, and hold to many other false doctrines, such as replacement  theology, infant baptism, and the like - all by the way supported from Calvin's institutes.

As well as this, many of your so called calvinists either have been wrongly claimed by the calvinist mobs to try to bolster their position, or like Spurgeon, they were schizophrenic Calvinists who held to a dual position of calvinistic election and total free will of men.

You have been told this before but still insist on adding Spurgeon's name automatically to the list at every opportunity.

It shows poor research and poor understanding of the man and his position.

 

​No, in this I'm not wrong. Every cal I've met it's true what I said. I never said every cal is like those cals. I've pointed out I've encountered such cals online and I have no doubt such are out there, probably even thick in some areas. However, of the cals I've met in person, having spoken with them, they don't look to Calvin, they don't follow Calvin, they don't defend Calvin, many know little to nothing of Calvin.

Spurgeon made his position very clear that he was a cal. I've read most of what he wrote and he was consistent in his stance as a cal tho he pointed to Paul's writings in Scripture as the authority on the subject, not Calvin.

It's not just some cals that hang on the words of men, there are many out there who back their positions more on the words of Scofield, Graham, Moody, Stanley, Luther, Sproul, Osteen, and on and on. With each it's important to go to the Scripture rather than argue about the man.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

No, what invalidates TULIP is that it is unbiblical.

It misuses and redefines biblical terms. 

Calvin was unsaved man who examined the Bible as a book of law, then created his own version of Catholicism with him as the leader,  and then ruled that religion by fear and threatenings. 

Those who follow this wicked man,  follow the ravings of a man opposed to God and opposed to God's Word.

​I wonder why someone would name a system of theology after an unsaved man who persecuted true Christians.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​No, in this I'm not wrong. Every cal I've met it's true what I said. I never said every cal is like those cals. I've pointed out I've encountered such cals online and I have no doubt such are out there, probably even thick in some areas. However, of the cals I've met in person, having spoken with them, they don't look to Calvin, they don't follow Calvin, they don't defend Calvin, many know little to nothing of Calvin.

Spurgeon made his position very clear that he was a cal. I've read most of what he wrote and he was consistent in his stance as a cal tho he pointed to Paul's writings in Scripture as the authority on the subject, not Calvin.

It's not just some cals that hang on the words of men, there are many out there who back their positions more on the words of Scofield, Graham, Moody, Stanley, Luther, Sproul, Osteen, and on and on. With each it's important to go to the Scripture rather than argue about the man.

You say you have read most of what Spurgeon wrote and yet you still misrepresent him.......

There is something wrong with this picture.

There is no doubt that he claimed to follow Calvin, but he also opposed Calvin's  teachings.

As to your claim that you are not wrong, if you refuse to see the point I made then there is nothing I  can do to help you.

They SAY they don't  follow Calvin and obviously they deceive you with their words, because to be a calvinist or to uphold the "doctrines of grace" as they call them is to be a follower of Calvin.

The SAY they look to Paul, but they twist his words to make them fit into their philosophy.

You refuse to see this and stand there innocently saying that they have somehow found this false doctrine from the Bible......

You are deceived - they found this doctrine from Calvin and from those who follow him.

 

Just because a man claims to be a fish, that doesn't  make him a fish. Just because a claims not to follow Calvin doesn't make it so.

Open your eyes and do some proper research, and begin to compare these teachers against the Bible.

No man who does so will keep saying the things you say about these men.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​I'm not looking for websites that defend cal or demonstrate anything. You had asked about a specific church to which I pointed out they have no website.

If you are interested in soul winning cals you can read Edwards, Whitefield, Spurgeon and Mueller; all of which were cals and all were soul winners.

Every call I've ever met in person looks to Scripture as their source, not Calvin. They all point to Paul as their main source for their views. As far as I can recall, they say Augustine was the first to write some about this subject and later Calvin gave attention to trying to put in writing what they claim was the view of the Apostle Paul and Christians for centuries prior to Calvin. Calvin, they will point out, didn't originate anything, he simply tried to write it out.

In any event, there are dozens of books revealing well known cals who were soul winners, as well as cal missions organizations if you wish to pursue such.

These days I only see a handful of churches of any kind doing much towards soul winning. Most Christians seem to do nothing and many of those who are more active are presenting a watered down "gospel" and/or they push people to say a "sinners prayer", then they tell them they are going to heaven, write down another mark in their record book so they can tell everyone how many souls they've saved yet neither their church nor any others around ever have these supposed new Christians entering their doors.

​John,

The calvin worshippers today have zero resemblance to any of the old timers you keep referring to. Calvin worship has taken a nose dive in modern times.

IMO you seem to experience very little but read very much and that may the point of your confusion in this.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​John,

The calvin worshippers today have zero resemblance to any of the old timers you keep referring to. Calvin worship has taken a nose dive in modern times.

IMO you seem to experience very little but read very much and that may the point of your confusion in this.

​Just because my experiences differ from yours doesn't mean I'm not experiencing very much.

Things can be very different from one place to the next, from one area to another, State to State, country to country. Yes, I also read a lot, something only a handful of others I know do.

Most of the churches near here are relatively the same regardless of the name they go by or whether they are cal, armin, neither. They are more social and/or secular in nature and often rather dead when it comes to the things of God.

Whatever you and others have personal experience with I don't question it or think something must be wrong if it happens to differ from my own. I know brothers in Christ who would never set foot in another Baptist church again due to their past experiences in Baptist churches but that differs from my experiences in Baptist churches so I have no wall up.

If the Word can't be brought to bear on a situation and allowed to work, bringing up the things of man isn't going to get it done.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​This is telling them to go out and make disciples (as it were) and bring them in; not to go forth and drag the lost into the home of the saved. Notice those not properly dressed (unsaved) who showed up were kicked out.

"Church" is to be the gathering of the saints (saved folks) for edification, teaching and instruction in holy living and spreading the Gospel. The saints are then to go forth share the Gospel, bringing those who hear and receive into the gathering of believers. 

 

​John can you explain a little better of what you mean the church is only to be the gathering of the saints saved folks, this sounds as though you're saying someone that's lost is not allowed to enter into Gods House, I've seen Gods House on fire filled with sinners getting saved. so I don't quite understand what you're saying brother ,no ill intent brother

God Bless 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​John can you explain a little better of what you mean the church is only to be the gathering of the saints saved folks, this sounds as though you're saying someone that's lost is not allowed to enter into Gods House, I've seen Gods House on fire filled with sinners getting saved. so I don't quite understand what you're saying brother ,no ill intent brother

God Bless 

​The way that I understand it is the primary purpose for the local assembly is for edification of the saints.  While, getting saved at church or preaching to lost sinners is a wonderful secondary component...the primary purpose of worship services is for saved Christians to grow in the Lord, learn, etc.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​John can you explain a little better of what you mean the church is only to be the gathering of the saints saved folks, this sounds as though you're saying someone that's lost is not allowed to enter into Gods House, I've seen Gods House on fire filled with sinners getting saved. so I don't quite understand what you're saying brother ,no ill intent brother

God Bless 

​If I may be so bold, I know John is not saying what you perceived but I understand how you would read it that way.  Definitely a place in church for unbelievers...but the preacher's mission should be to instruct those that are saved to grow in the Lord.  While, scheduled "door knocking" would obviously be focused more towards giving the light to the unbelievers in the community.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​John can you explain a little better of what you mean the church is only to be the gathering of the saints saved folks, this sounds as though you're saying someone that's lost is not allowed to enter into Gods House, I've seen Gods House on fire filled with sinners getting saved. so I don't quite understand what you're saying brother ,no ill intent brother

God Bless 

​Dennis managed to answer what I would have posted. (Thank you Dennis!)

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

At our church, we create ways of reaching teens as well as all other age groups.  Many teens have been saved through an after school Bible study, and many activities are organized as ways to bring unsaved in to hear a gospel message and whatever other seeds our saved teens and others can sow.   We're seeing a steady growth in the area of teens serving the Lord after they get saved through our ministries, and some are seriously talking about wanting to become missionaries. 

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Members

​John can you explain a little better of what you mean the church is only to be the gathering of the saints saved folks, this sounds as though you're saying someone that's lost is not allowed to enter into Gods House, I've seen Gods House on fire filled with sinners getting saved. so I don't quite understand what you're saying brother ,no ill intent brother

God Bless 

​The assertion is correct according to 2 Cor.6:14.  The Bible is very clear on what is to go on in church.  And that doesn't include, bringing in heathens, debates (Rom 1), or women doing anything other than learning in silence.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

​John can you explain a little better of what you mean the church is only to be the gathering of the saints saved folks, this sounds as though you're saying someone that's lost is not allowed to enter into Gods House, I've seen Gods House on fire filled with sinners getting saved. so I don't quite understand what you're saying brother ,no ill intent brother

God Bless 

​The assembling together of saints is intended to be just that, an assembly of the saved for corporate prayer, worship, preaching, teaching, edification, growth in Christ, preparation to live for Christ and spread the Gospel.

I didn't say an unsaved person couldn't enter a church, only that "church time" is primarily supposed to be an assembly of believers. In many churches this is neglected to the point many who sit in the pews are immature in the faith and remain so. In some churches the influence of the lost far outweighs the influence of the believers.

Sacrificing the assembly of the saints for massive mixing of the lost among the believers and giving focus to the lost deprives the believers of the needed time of separation from the world to be assembled with other believers before God so they may become rooted and grounded to live for the Lord and take the Gospel forth to the lost.

One of the reasons many don't soul win is because they have come to believe that's what church is for. Just tell someone to go to church and their "soul winning" duty is done. The primary purpose of the church is to be the training ground of the saints. As our military goes into training and assembles to be set forth to face what they must, so believers need to be trained in assembly and sent forth to do as they are called to.

Link to post
Share on other sites

In support of the boldness and creativity for serving the Lord expressed in the OP, I  think if I'll  keep the focus on the blessings and methods of reaching out to the lost with the gospel and seeds of the word of God, talking about real experiences and honest servant's heart desire to give ourselves to the Lord and His gospel, the Calvinists will be left in the dust of their dry intellectualisms.......and in that spirit, I'll relate my most recent witnessing encounter....

I was waiting in line at a fast food restaurant, some Christians from other churches were there...it was after the evening service on Sunday.....I said hello to the Christians from a Baptist church, while my friends were talking to a couple from a church of God or something like that...Pentecostals with a great testimony serving the Lord and praising Him through amazing trials of sicknesses...a man in line between me and the Baptists from another church said to me, "how are ya?", and I answered my usual "better than I deserve" in hope of stirring conversation in the gospel.  The man started arguing with me, telling me not to think that way, "we're all God's children", so I figured he was lost and tried to get him to see we deserve nothing good, and everything good is a gift from God, and anything better than the fire of Hell is good.  He said something like "oh, yes, everything's a gift, I lost it all LAST NIGHT when I had a stroke, and now it's given back to me".  I forgot to put tracts in my pocket that night, so I had to get one from my friends and I handed it to the man telling him God wants to give us eternal life....I figured the guy had a wake up call from God....he quickly told me he's a Christian and he loves everybody.....I said "so how could you argue with me saying we deserve good things?"  If he's a Christian, which I seriously doubt because all he wanted to talk about is his warm fuzzy feelings of love and not one word about the gospel...he was gushing all over a paramedic who stopped in for a snack, loving him and thanking him for being a paramedic but not one word about Jesus or the gospel......now I'm wishing I would have made a better contact and try to get the guy into church.....if he's saved, he sure has a story which he could use for a great testimony and he sure could have more effect for the gospel by telling others of God's love in Jesus Christ  rather than telling everybody how much he loves them himself.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Moderators

​John can you explain a little better of what you mean the church is only to be the gathering of the saints saved folks, this sounds as though you're saying someone that's lost is not allowed to enter into Gods House, I've seen Gods House on fire filled with sinners getting saved. so I don't quite understand what you're saying brother ,no ill intent brother

God Bless 

Brother John  I don't know if you noticed my post back to you " which some haven't "

but I will post it again - Dennis answered before you but I felt you would answer the same I understood your post but I felt that some would take a chance to argue without understanding what you where saying  which is often done here is why I ask the question , thank you brother Dennis and you a as well brother John,in which should have ended   with this other than you posting back to me, maybe I should have PM  you, I had no intent of changing the post '' 

God bless and thank you for you answer 

​Stop, back up, re-read. He said Dennis gave the same answer that he (John81) would be re-typing to save you the trouble of referencing back and reading.

He told you the same each time you repeated yourself -- if he didn't respond that would be one thing, but he did.

If you want to respond based off of what Dennis said just as though it represents John's mindset -- go for it, John says that it does.

If you just want to act like the bratty kid who pesters his mama in order to get what he wants --------- KNOCK IT OFF!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Who's Online   0 Members, 0 Anonymous, 27 Guests (See full list)

    There are no registered users currently online

×
×
  • Create New...