Members Steve Schwenke Posted February 22, 2015 Members Share Posted February 22, 2015 You can look at it any way that you want to. The fact is that Jesus Christ gave 7 specific statements about His physical return to this planet in the chapter. I listed the references earlier in this thread.The physical return of Jesus Christ to this planet is described for us very clearly in Revelation 19. He comes on a horse with His army, and physically destroys the army of the Anti-Christ. He takes the AntiChrist and the false prophet (both described in Revelation 13) thrown into the lake of fire. Revelation 20 continues the narrative by describing a reign of Jesus Christ on this earth that lasts 1,000 years, with Satan being bound in chains in the bottomless pit. There is a resurrection of SAINTS at this time. At the end of 1,000 years, Satan is loosed. He deceives the nations and gathers an army for one final attempt to dethrone Jesus Christ. It ends in utter failure, once again.This event is then followed by the final judgment, which is then followed by the New Heaven, New Earth, and New Jerusalem. That is the Biblical order of events. Matthew 24 and 25 prophecy of the events that culminate in the return of Jesus Christ as described in Revelation 19. The Lord Jesus Christ tells us that "this generation" would see ALL of the events in their lifetime. Perhaps the generation that heard Jesus Christ make this prophesy thought it would be THEIR generation. But the fact that not all of the events actually happened only proves that the physical return of Jesus Christ to this planet is yet future. As such, the rest of the events in Matthew 24 are also future, in that these were a series of events that lead to the physical return of Jesus Christ to this planet. Thus, the prophecies in Matthew 24 are a series of events that are all inter-related to one another, and that would all happen in a brief period of time (i.e. within in one generation), and would all lead up to one major event - the physical return of Jesus Christ to this planet. Therefore, it makes no difference if you try to make three questions from the verse - the answer to the (1) question or (3) questions are the same. The prophecy is the same. It is all related to the Second Coming of Christ as described in Revelation 19. The rest of the prophecies are confirmed by John the Apostle in Revelation 6-19. These prophecies are not scattered events over the last 2,000 years. These prophecies may have a partial fulfillment IN TYPE (say like in 70AD), but inasmuch as the entire series of events has not yet been fulfilled, nor has Jesus Christ physically returned to this earth as He Himself foretold in the chapter (7 times!), and as John the Apostle confirmed, then the only logical and sane conclusion is that these events are yet future.In Christ, Jim_Alaska and HappyChristian 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Covenanter Posted February 22, 2015 Members Share Posted February 22, 2015 Mat. 24 Mark 13. & Luke 21 All begin with a prophecy of the destruction, and the disciples' questions. Jesus answers them, and gives warning signs as to when to flee the city. Those warning signs, & the action advised do not relate to the second coming for resurrection and judgment. There is a clear end to that part of his prophecy - this generation. Believers heeding those signs fled from Jerusalem according to Jesus' warning, lest they suffer in those days of vengeance.Now read Mat. 24:34-44Jesus is now speaking of the passing away of heaven and earth at a totally unknown time. Yes, Jesus will come again for final judgment, but the ONLY actions for us in readiness for that coming is to be serving him faithfully, watching and praying. We cannot flee from the wrath of God; why should we, when we are safer in Christ than those in the ark? The ONLY safe place for the wicked is repentance, turning to Christ for salvation. The warnings in the first part of the chapter do not apply to us, except in general, though the encouragements do. The instructions in the final part are on going until Jesus does return. If "this generation" is some future generation, possibly ours, how do we know? EVERYONE who has asserted that the end was coming on their generation has been shown to be a false prophet. Now our new Bible Scholar says a generation is 100 years. He will be dead & answering to God before he is proved wrong. Now I will make a prophecy - many people will continue to make false predictions about the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ, but one day he will come - and surprise them. Mat. 24:44 Invicta and ThePilgrim 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Steve Schwenke Posted February 23, 2015 Members Share Posted February 23, 2015 If "this generation" is some future generation, possibly ours, how do we know? EVERYONE who has asserted that the end was coming on their generation has been shown to be a false prophet. Now our new Bible Scholar says a genng eration is 100 years. He will be dead & answering to God before he is proved wrong. SimpleEverything that is prophesied in the chapter comes to pass in ONE GENERATION. It all culminates with the physical, bodily return of Jesus Christ mentioned 7 times in Mt. 24, and described in detail in Revelation 19.Since this has not yet happened, we know it must be future. It COULD be our generation, but we don't know. NOBODY knows WHEN. The chapter is one prophecy. It is a series of events leading up to the return of Christ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members John81 Posted February 23, 2015 Author Members Share Posted February 23, 2015 I've never heard a Baptist preach that the three distinct questions, with three distinct answers, are all one and the same and all tied to one generation. Virtually all the Baptist pastors I've heard preach on this are pre-trib Rapture folks too. Genevanpreacher and Covenanter 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Invicta Posted February 23, 2015 Members Share Posted February 23, 2015 SimpleEverything that is prophesied in the chapter comes to pass in ONE GENERATION. It all culminates with the physical, bodily return of Jesus Christ mentioned 7 times in Mt. 24, and described in detail in Revelation 19.Since this has not yet happened, we know it must be future. It COULD be our generation, but we don't know. NOBODY knows WHEN. The chapter is one prophecy. It is a series of events leading up to the return of Christ. There were two distinct questions and two distinct answers.Question one. "Tell us, when shall these things be?" As a response to Jesus' statement "See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down." The answer Jesus gave expanded on his previous statement and then answered the question. "Tell us, when shall these things be?" He told them plainly that they would occur within in the Generation that he was addressing. In Matt 23 he tells the Scribes etc, that "36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation." He was speaking about the same destruction.Question two. "what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?" The answer begins "36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only" Two distinct question and two distinct answers. Genevanpreacher, ThePilgrim and Covenanter 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Covenanter Posted February 24, 2015 Members Share Posted February 24, 2015 Steve,Many things have to happen before Jesus returns, some of which were signs warning believers to flee Jerusalem, as detailed in Mat. 24, Mark 13 & Luke 21. So far 2,000 years.When Jesus spoke of his coming in the clouds, his hearers knew he was quoting Daniel -that's why they accused him of blasphemy.My points are Scripture, NOT "foreign elements."You need to address the "coming" in the husbandmen/vineyard parable. When was it or when will it be?The "coming" in that parable is the same as the "coming" in Matthew 24. The Fact is that Jesus did NOT come at all in 70 AD. Thus, He has yet to return and fulfill these prophecies. The generation that is alive when the prophecies begin to be fulfilled, will see ALL of the prophecies fulfilled in their lifetime. 70 AD was just "batting practice." The vineyard parable Mat. 21:33-41 concludes: 40 When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen?41 They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.42 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.44 And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder.45 And when the chief priests and Pharisees had heard his parables, they perceived that he spake of them.If Jesus is actually referring his yet future coming for resurrection & judgement then apparently those who recognised the parable was spoken against them escaped being "miserably destroyed," the vineyard was never taken from them, and never given to another nation to present fruit to the Lord of the vineyard.They also escaped Moses' warning, confirmed by Peter:Deut. 18:18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him. 19 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.20 But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die.21 And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the Lord hath not spoken?22 When a prophet speaketh in the name of the Lord, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the Lord hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him. Acts 3:22 For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you. 23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.24 Yea, and all the prophets from Samuel and those that follow after, as many as have spoken, have likewise foretold of these days.25 Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed.26 Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.Note: When a prophet speaketh in the name of the Lord, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the Lord hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.Jesus gave a very explicit warning which was understood by the chief priests as applying to them. But Steve says he was referring to his second coming, & that AD 70 was "batting practice" whatever that means. It's not a term in my KJV nor my concordance. Thus his prophecy against chief priests & Pharisees is yet to be fulfilled, & Jesus spoke presumptuously. The scoffers of Peter's letter were justified in their scoffing. No. There is a sense in which Jesus did come in AD 70 to fulfill his prophecies against "this generation" led by the chief priests & Pharisees, & to raise up the church as a "holy nation" bearing fruit for the Lord. That coming did not preclude his future coming for resurrection & judgment. His presence at the dedication of tabernacle & temple was apparent by overshadowing clouds. He led the people by pillar of cloud & fire. Why is it hard to believe that his presence at the destruction was real but veiled by clouds? Invicta 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members John81 Posted February 25, 2015 Author Members Share Posted February 25, 2015 Christ will return on time. We are called to be ready in that we are daily choosing to pursue growth in Christ and daily about the Lord's business. Invicta and Covenanter 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MountainChristian Posted February 26, 2015 Members Share Posted February 26, 2015 Luke 2129 And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees;30 When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand.31 So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand.32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.33 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.34 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.35 For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.Covenanter, I think all trees means they all put forth new growth starting in the spring and then summer follows. Some start later than others almost near summer but I know of no tree that puts forth new growth in the fall or winter. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~I want to escape like it says in verse 36.~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~If the internet is being truthful Hal is on wife number 4 and he is worth 42 million dollars. Why does Hal think we need to know what year Jesus will return? Covenanter 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.