Under The Skin

[Guest]

Does it bother others when people print statements without the facts to back it up? Does it make you think the author is just attempting to stir the pot? Maybe they just want to take credit for originating a thought. I've read statements when people say this or that and don't back it up with any proof. When they are confronted for the proof they seldom if ever provide it. It becomes like Lois Lerner and her IRS hard-drive "I just can't can't remember or it must have been erased."

[John81]

That depends upon the setting.

[Guest]

Any setting other than just casual conversation. Are there any circumstances where people should withhold their evidence? Isn't that kind of like lying?

 

Abstract examples:

 

Some protesters in MO. making the 'raised hands' statements without having been at the scene of the recent shooting.

 

An individual makes a statement based on "an article" as if it were indisputable proof and doesn't provide the reference.

[2Tim215]

Any setting other than just casual conversation. Are there any circumstances where people should withhold their evidence? Isn't that kind of like lying?

 

 

Pro_29:11  A fool uttereth all his mind: but a wise man keepeth it in till afterwards.

[Ukulelemike]

Sadly, preachers do this all the time-they hear a good allegory or OBject lesson, which they use, and someone else hears and passes them on and they virtually become fact until someone looks it up and finds it to be false.

 

I found this to be the case with most preachers' comments about sheep. "Sheep are stupid-they don't know to come out of the rain! They'll just fall into the water when they drink if someone's not there to keep them from it." et al.  yet, now having kept sheep, they are not stupid at all-they don't come in from the rain because their wool insulates them and often they don't need to. If its real bad, their woll may become waterlogged and they may not be able to-not about being stupid.

 

Sheep are experts at escaping enclosures-they will find a weakness and exploit it. And want a real challenge hunting? hunt wild sheep-they are very canny.

 

No, the thing with sheep is, kept sheep are very needy-they need all their needs met by the shepherd because they are otherwise not able to have access to food and water. So like kept sheep, Christians rely on Jesus our Shepherd to supply our needs. But we aren't stupid and neither are sheep.

[John81]

The media, and especially preachers, should do fact checking.

 

In a better world the average person would care about facts but that's not the case in America. It's common for folks on every side of an issue in America to highlight anything they think can help their cause, whether they know it to be true or not; while at the same time hiding or ignoring facts that don't help them.

 

Blogs, forums, social media, I don't expect a lot from.

 

Protestors typically have some chip on their shoulder, or just want to be a part of something, and are not interested in facts, but emotionalism and perceptions. Unfortunately, the media has followed that trend to a large degree.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

Another good example is the plethora of people on Facebook that are changing their avatars to the symbol for the arabic "n", because of a article going around that claimed that it means "Nazarene" and is used to identify Christians.

However, upon research, I found out that the arabic that is used to identify Christians is not "n", but rather it is "masihi", 

We also see many false posts of diseases, rOBberies or kidnapped children that, upon research, proves to be false as well.

[Guest]

Any setting other than just casual conversation. Are there any circumstances where people should withhold their evidence? Isn't that kind of like lying?

 

 

2 Corinthians 4:2 But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God.

[2Tim215]

2 Corinthians 4:2 But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God.

2Co 4:1  Therefore seeing we have this ministry, as we have received mercy, we faint not;
2Co 4:2  But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God.
2Co 4:3  But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

 

This is what happens when things are taken out of context. The verse has nothing to with "withholding evidence" nor not speaking your entire mind and keeping some things to your self. It has to do with the ministry, the Gospel and the truth that is ours in Christ. Keeping things to yourself is not lying. Lying is when you speak an untruth. It is an action. Even if someone asks you something, refusing to divulge it is not lying or being dishonest if you openly state that you will not divulge it. This is a heart matter. The heart knows when it is in sin. If this was the case then by refusing to tell a child the facts of life when they are too young to know it you would be lying. just one example where a wise man keeps it till afterwards.

[Guest]

2Co 4:1  Therefore seeing we have this ministry, as we have received mercy, we faint not;
2Co 4:2  But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God.
2Co 4:3  But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

 

This is what happens when things are taken out of context. The verse has nothing to with "withholding evidence" nor not speaking your entire mind and keeping some things to your self. It has to do with the ministry, the Gospel and the truth that is ours in Christ. Keeping things to yourself is not lying. Lying is when you speak an untruth. It is an action. Even if someone asks you something, refusing to divulge it is not lying or being dishonest if you openly state that you will not divulge it. This is a heart matter. The heart knows when it is in sin. If this was the case then by refusing to tell a child the facts of life when they are too young to know it you would be lying. just one example where a wise man keeps it till afterwards.

Precept upon precept. The precept from the verse is, why hide things; that is a form of deceit. I don't have to go through the entire Bible from front to back to show God does not condone deceit and that it is a form of lying? Further, who the main deceiver and father of lies is? Or, can I just give one citation which establishes the precept? Are you arguing against the precept of honesty or attempting to justify dishonesty? I don't think you are; I think you're attempting to be argumentative; I won't participate. I'll just close the thread because you're going out of bounds and there is no profit in it.