Jump to content
  • Welcome Guest

    For an ad free experience on Online Baptist, Please login or register for free

One God, Three Persons, Co-Equal


Recommended Posts

  • Replies 46
  • Created
  • Last Reply
  • Members

I'm starting to do my own critical thinking on it.

My experience is that there is definitely something in my own nature that is inclined to sin, but the thought of attributing it to a sin nature that God allowed me to have would be blaming God, which I don't see how he can hold me accountable for sin if that is really the case. 

 

I struggle with how we can have a free will, but also a sin nature that causes us to sin, yet somehow God punishes us for just doing what we are by nature.. 

 

Kind of like dying your childs hair red and then beating them for having red hair in my opinion.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

My experience is that there is definitely something in my own nature that is inclined to sin, but the thought of attributing it to a sin nature that God allowed me to have would be blaming God, which I don't see how he can hold me accountable for sin if that is really the case. 

 

I struggle with how we can have a free will, but also a sin nature that causes us to sin, yet somehow God punishes us for just doing what we are by nature.. 

 

Kind of like dying your childs hair red and then beating them for having red hair in my opinion.

 

Maybe you should start a new thread on it. 

 

But I can see you are thinking, and thinking correctly. 

 

But be prepared, you will take a LOT of heat on this one. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Maybe you should start a new thread on it. 

 

But I can see you are thinking, and thinking correctly. 

 

But be prepared, you will take a LOT of heat on this one. 

I've been taking heat ever since I got saved.

 

I have the most conservative music stance out of any Baptist I know and it gets me heat all the time.

 

of course being KJO as well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

I've been taking heat ever since I got saved.

 

I have the most conservative music stance out of any Baptist I know and it gets me heat all the time.

 

of course being KJO as well.

 

Good for you Jordan. You stay true to God and he will use you. That is a wonderful life. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Winman, I know you are and I will no longer discuss with you on any subject and at this point I will block your post from my view and put you on an ignore list.

 

Well, that is certainly your prerogative, but you are going to miss out on some interesting discussions. I have been accused of many things on forums, but being boring or afraid to address controversial subjects is not one of them. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Well, that is certainly your prerogative, but you are going to miss out on some interesting discussions. I have been accused of many things on forums, but being boring or afraid to address controversial subjects is not one of them. 

Not really in my last dealings with you on other Baptist and KJV forums you were pretty much a trouble maker and I see it arising here, that is why at this point I will ignore you.  Not that it is boring or I am afraid.

 

I am glad to take advantage of my prerogative.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

Yes, this was a sign for John the Baptist. Nevertheless, he was told that whom the Spirit descended "upon" and whom it rested "on" was the promised Christ. It does not say the Spirit "indwelled" Jesus or was "in" him.

 

Jhn 1:32 And John bare record, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him.
33 And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost.
 
Does scripture say the Holy Spirit was "in" Jesus? NO, it repeatedly says the Spirit was "upon" him, or "on" him. That is significant don't you think? 
 
Now, I could be wrong, Jesus said the Father dwells "in" him (Jhn 14:10), so perhaps the Spirit dwelled in him as well, but the scriptures do not say that anywhere that I know of. I would prOBably assume that the Spirit dwelled in Jesus if not for Acts 2:33. 

 

Jesus Christ never said he was "filled" with the Holy Spirit. If God the Son needed to be "filled" or thought it was important for you or anyone else to hear He was filled then, it would have been recorded. 

Do you believe Jesus Christ had to be filled with the Holy Spirit?

 

I've already said the descending of the "Spirit" on Jesus was a sign, mainly to the Jews (John included), showing the Fathers delight in His only begotten Son.

John 1:32 "And John bare record, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him."

Do you take this for some need of the Holy Spirit in Jesus Christ?

 

In John 14:10 what we can glean is that Jesus Christ is in fact a member of the triune Godhead.

John 14:10 "Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works."

You refer again to Acts 2:33; where Christ has finished the work He came to do. Therefore it was time for the Father, executor of the Godhead to send the Holy Ghost "promise" to indwell Christians.

Acts 2:33 "Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear."

The Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost are all God in their own right of course they are all part of the "ONE GOD" with all the attributes of one another.

What point, theory, or new doctrine are you attempting to forward?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Not really in my last dealings with you on other Baptist and KJV forums you were pretty much a trouble maker and I see it arising here, that is why at this point I will ignore you.  Not that it is boring or I am afraid.

 

I am glad to take advantage of my prerogative.

Winman is a poster who I value, he does not cause trouble and I believe he has a Christ like spirit, I have had much interaction with him on the Baptist Board.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Winman is a poster who I value, he does not cause trouble and I believe he has a Christ like spirit, I have had much interaction with him on the Baptist Board.

 

Well Jordan, I do not purposely cause trouble, but I invariably cause trouble because I ask hard questions people do not like. 

 

I simply do not accept what I am told simply because that is what people have always believed. I read the scriptures, and I ask God to show me the true meaning of scripture. I am not claiming infallibility, far from it. But if I see scripture that OBviously does not agree with what is being taught in church, I am going to question it. Folks do not like this, folks grow comfortable being taught by others, and they do not like it when someone like me rocks the boat. Too bad. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Do you believe Jesus Christ had to be filled with the Holy Spirit?

 

Well yes, because Jesus said he had to come to John the Baptist and be baptized. I am not sure why, but Jesus implied that it was necessary. 

 

Mat 3:13 Then cometh Jesus from Galilee to Jordan unto John, to be baptized of him.
14 But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me?
15 And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.
16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:
17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
 
Now, I do not understand why Jesus had to be baptized, but Jesus seemed to imply it was necessary, and that is good enough for me. 
 
As for the Spirit descending upon him, why would he need the Spirit to descend upon him if he already had the indwelling Spirit? I mean, the Spirit fell on believers on Pentacost, but they did not have the indwelling Spirit until that day. 
 
I agree that it was a sign for the Spirit to descend upon Jesus, but I also believe he needed the Spirit to perform miracles. He did not perform any miracles until the Spirit descended upon him. He seems to have been operating as a normal man under the influence of the Holy Ghost as the OT prophets were. 
 
I might be wrong, Jesus said the Father dwelleth in him, so perhaps the Spirit did as well. But then again, perhaps not, I am not sure. 
 
Do you take this for some need of the Holy Spirit in Jesus Christ?
 
I believe so, I think Jesus came as a man. He had to defeat Satan where Adam failed. It is nothing for God to defeat Satan, but it is quite a feat for a man to defeat Satan. I believe Jesus had to defeat Satan the way a man would, by faith and OBedience to God's word. There is scripture to support my view. 
 
Heb 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.
 
I believe Jesus had to defeat Satan as a man to redeem man. He had to become like us in every way. Men in the OT did not have the indwelling Spirit, but they did have the Spirit "upon" them, and I think Jesus had to war against Satan in this fashion to defeat him. God certainly cannot die, but Jesus defeated Satan "through death". 
 
What point, theory, or new doctrine are you attempting to forward?
 
None whatsoever. I am just saying that Acts 2:33 seems to say Jesus received the Holy Ghost after he ascended, and then he was able to give the Spirit out to believers. Jesus told his disciples he must go away to give them the Spirit. Now, he HAD to sprinkle his blood on the mercy seat, otherwise men's sins were not atoned for. Perhaps this is all he meant. But Jesus told his disciples to wait for the Spirit. 
 
Acts 2:33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.
 
Now, the first phrase absolutely says Jesus "being by the right hand of God exalted". That is speaking about something God the Father did for Jesus, not believers. 
 
Next, the word "and" connects the second phrase to the first and strongly implies that not only was Jesus exalted by his Father, but he also received the Holy Ghost from him. 
 
Grammar is grammar, that word "and" has real meaning. 
 
I just want to know what scripture really says, I am not trying to forward some new doctrine. I assure you I am not the first person to question this verse. I would be willing to bet that many thousands have questioned this verse exactly as I have. 
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.



×
×
  • Create New...