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Dorightchristians - King James Onlyism Before Peter Ruckman


Dr James Ach

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What verses?

Did you actually read the quotes?

from my phone, no i cant, the font and background made it hard to read.

 

 

This goes to the very values of the men who compiled the texts that very nearly ALL MV'S are translated from.
They deny the innerrency of Scripture.
They deny the creation account,

not all manuscripts were studied from W/H, others have studied it. My old ministry brought in a professor, when we switched from KJ to ESV, He never denied any major doctrine of Scripture.

many believers don not believe the innerrency of Scripture, they believe the inspiration of Scripture, but you get many copies of copies and you can run into some innerency.

I have never heard any believer deny the creation account since I have left the IFB

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All of this "prove this" and "prove that"...or..."show me chapter and verse" doesn't amount to anything except what one chooses to believe regardless of "the proof".

You lie, I showed everybody from Scripture, KJ mind you, on my stance on alcohol, which has stood for centuries in the church, and you all scoffed and attacked me when your own prejudices blinded you to Scripture. So dont give me that I pick and choose my believes when everyone here at OB has been guilty of this.

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from my phone, no i cant, the font and background made it hard to read.


not all manuscripts were studied from W/H, others have studied it. My old ministry brought in a professor, when we switched from KJ to ESV, He never denied any major doctrine of Scripture.
many believers don not believe the innerrency of Scripture, they believe the inspiration of Scripture, but you get many copies of copies and you can run into some innerency.
I have never heard any believer deny the creation account since I have left the IFB


Westcott and Hot - the compilers of the Greek that basically all MV'S are translated from did not believe these things.
They are not trustworthy to handle the Word of God to produce something that all MV'S come from.

There are plenty - some even right here - who dispute the innerrency of the Bible.
There are plenty of "Christians" who follow These two guys in their error.

But the point is that every MV relies on these two men who did not really believe that they were handling the Word of God.

That doesn't even make sense......
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God promised to preserve his words (Psalm 12:7)...and yes, I realize that people try to claim that's talking about the poor and needy who will be preserved...it doesn't work. He's talking about his words. Study it out. Study the Hebrew MASORETIC grammar (not the Greek Septuagint) and you'll see that it can only be speaking of his words. If it's not, then there's some mighty OLD people walking this earth today since they were kept and preserved from that generation forever..

Break the verse down in Hebrew then get back to me. either way if you beleive that you make God a liar!!! then what did man do for 1611 years or the 611 years that English was around( I read it came about 1000 AD)

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You lie, I showed everybody from Scripture, KJ mind you, on my stance on alcohol, which has stood for centuries in the church, and you all scoffed and attacked me when your own prejudices blinded you to Scripture. So dont give me that I pick and choose my believes when everyone here at OB has been guilty of this.

 

You say that I lie: I personally don't remember scoffing or attacking you about your stance on alcohol.  If I did, show me, and I'll apologize. I do know that I have been hard on you about your signature, and you should be ashamed for flaunting such in light of the stance of this forum. It shows rebellion toward the rules.

 

And just because the church may have believed something doesn't make it right. A lot of churches are wrong on a lot of things. Anyway, I don't know that the early church (if that's what you meant) held your stance or not, and it doesn't matter to me...

 

Break the verse down in Hebrew then get back to me. either way if you beleive that you make God a liar!!! then what did man do for 1611 years or the 611 years that English was around( I read it came about 1000 AD)

 

No, you break it down under the conditions that I set. Find out for yourself. However, if you don't want to take the time to discover for yourself, I'll consider sending you a link where I did break it down. However, I'll choose whether to do so or not, because I don't think you would be swayed anyway.

 

What did man do for 1611 years or the 611 years that English was around? They had copies of God's word...that's what they did. You're barking up the wrong tree with me on this one Jeffrey. I'm not an English only advocate.

 

Anyway, with all due respect...I only answered you because you quoted me. I'll not answer you any more unless you don't want to look the verse up under the conditions that I set forth.  You won't change your mind unless you see it for yourself.

 

Oh yeah, and if you can show me where I scoffed and attacked you because of your stand on alcohol, I'll respond to that with an apology...publicly.

 

Other than that, I employ Romans 16:17.

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I wouldn't say that, Jeffrey.  You are very intelligent.  If you could get over your beef with the IFB church you attended for years, you would be quite valuable to IFB's everywhere.My beef with the IFB is that it focuses on too many issues that I don't think is helpful to Christ, I'll explain below 

Do you think I like everything that my pastor preaches on Sunday?  No, I don't.I dont also agree with my elders now, I disagreed with my old IFB pastor, but that wasnt the issue, it never got to that point, I can disagree with people and still worship/fellowship with them

However, I know it comes from the KJV.  It's called conviction.Conviction means nothing if it aint grounded in Christ 

When he preaches, he also gives his opinion, at times.  Do I always agree with him?  No, I don't.  However, there is no perfect church.  You won't find one anywhere on God's earth.  People are not perfect, so how can a church be perfect?Your right, and I'll touch on that below.

 Why not look for another IFB church to attend, rather than go down the road you are going?  It pains me to see IFB's leaving the faith b/c of something that affected you on a personal basis.Trust me , it was for the better

 Whatever that was.  You have too much to offer, And I am giving it at the ministry where I am at now

 and have invested too much time in the IFB to take the road you are taking now.  We are in need of more warriors that bring people to the saving knowledge of Jesus Christ.  You won't find that knowledge in a Modern Version. Then you are denying the power of the Holy Spirit

 You will find deluded thinking.Actually, the Gospel became more clear after I started attending the ministry I am at now

  The truth is in the KJV and IFB's still hold to the KJV.  You have no prOBlem understanding it.  You have proved that time and time again.  Why not use it, instead of using sloppy seconds?  First, I understand the KJ, Had to look up certain things time to time, but I understand it. Second, I would never call God's Word sloppy seconds, regardless if I disagreed with the translation, ie; Good News for Modern man  

I have told you over our personal messages that I wanted to start a thread on Jesus, you know why? I never hear about Him here. I never hear about His compassion, His mercy, His grace, All I hear is people talk about here is their convictions, their standards, the old paths, but never about Jesus!!!!

I want to hear about God's love for man and how He humbled himself for us!!! and took the cross and attained salvation for His people. THAT is what I never heard about at my IFB church. When I went to my new ministry, the very first service, I admit, I walked in there with my guard up around all these " liberals". I was floored and knocked off my foundation of pride when the message was about the Grace of Christ It was like i heard the Gospel for the first time! I heard brothers and sisters open up to me about the sins they struggle with and the hardness that they experience at times.But their life is focused on one thing, The Gospel I hear/see people hear get wound up over Bible versions and gays and worldliness and not focus on the most important thing, JESUS!!!

Do you realize that it is the goodness of God that leads people to repentance? I get so sick of people bragging on convictions and make everything about themselves. 
I tell everybody here what I told Candle over a PM, Am I a Calvinist? I don't know, I see some of Calvin's points in Scripture, I see some Arminians  views in Scripture, I see Pre-trib, I see Amil,( I always thought that arguing prophesy was a waste of time, because of what will happen will happen and it will be like nOBody expected, Don't believe me, ask the Pharisees, they had the "theological ducks in a row" and look what happened to them.)

All in all, it seems too many here worry about superficial things and not worry about Christ, That's why I left the IFB, and I am not going back!

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Amen brother NoNic and brother Dave  

NoNic I don't see any being sarcasm just the plain truth and if others see it differently then they have a prOBlem 

 

I get tired of all the nonsense about the KJB and people trying to force me to prove to them what I believe trying to draw me into an argument with them which I will not do. 

 

those of such thoughts I'm in question of to how many lost souls have they lead to Jesus today, this week, this month, this year or have they ever tried.it appears they have no time for anything else but to question Gods Holly Word given to us through the KJB

 

Satan's hard at work trying to destroy the KJB  and it makes one wonder why not destroy all the MV's as well. 

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Well our church here is rising up for our local community.
Things are beginning to happen, people are beginning to excited about reaching into our community for Christ.

There are heaps of churches - both IFB and other - doing nothing for Christ - and heaps who ARE.

This place is primarily for discussion between Christians - it is not PRIMARILY a place of first witness to unsaved. Some do come here to find out about Christ but most already know Him - or at least about Him.

That is why the topics are as they are.

And you argue about "side issues" as much as anyone.

If you think Bible versions are unimportant, why even take part in a thread that is PRECISELY about Bible versions?

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Well our church here is rising up for our local community.
Things are beginning to happen, people are beginning to excited about reaching into our community for Christ.

There are heaps of churches - both IFB and other - doing nothing for Christ - and heaps who ARE.

This place is primarily for discussion between Christians - it is not PRIMARILY a place of first witness to unsaved. Some do come here to find out about Christ but most already know Him - or at least about Him.

That is why the topics are as they are.

And you argue about "side issues" as much as anyone.

If you think Bible versions are unimportant, why even take part in a thread that is PRECISELY about Bible versions?

Therein lies the prOBlem. I have come to learn that everything,  I mean everything, revolves around the Gospel. It is more than just "getting saved". It continues through your life and is the main reason we gather to worship Jesus. Which I rarely hear on this site. The Gospel is more than just for the "unsaved".

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And the discussions are on the whole about the details of matters.

It is generally understood by most on this site that Christ should be the Centre of our lives.

But you go ahead and continue in your belief that you are the only one here who really has the right focus.

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I have told you over our personal messages that I wanted to start a thread on Jesus, you know why? I never hear about Him here. I never hear about His compassion, His mercy, His grace, All I hear is people talk about here is their convictions, their standards, the old paths, but never about Jesus!!!!

I want to hear about God's love for man and how He humbled himself for us!!! and took the cross and attained salvation for His people. THAT is what I never heard about at my IFB church. When I went to my new ministry, the very first service, I admit, I walked in there with my guard up around all these " liberals". I was floored and knocked off my foundation of pride when the message was about the Grace of Christ It was like i heard the Gospel for the first time! I heard brothers and sisters open up to me about the sins they struggle with and the hardness that they experience at times.But their life is focused on one thing, The Gospel I hear/see people hear get wound up over Bible versions and gays and worldliness and not focus on the most important thing, JESUS!!!

Do you realize that it is the goodness of God that leads people to repentance? I get so sick of people bragging on convictions and make everything about themselves. 
I tell everybody here what I told Candle over a PM, Am I a Calvinist? I don't know, I see some of Calvin's points in Scripture, I see some Arminians  views in Scripture, I see Pre-trib, I see Amil,( I always thought that arguing prophesy was a waste of time, because of what will happen will happen and it will be like nOBody expected, Don't believe me, ask the Pharisees, they had the "theological ducks in a row" and look what happened to them.)

All in all, it seems too many here worry about superficial things and not worry about Christ, That's why I left the IFB, and I am not going back!

 

I am patiently waiting for you to start that thread, Jeffrey.   :)  I have no idea what kind of IFB church you went to for all those years.  I doesn't sound like my church, though.  It doesn't sound like the IFB church I went to for four years, and it doesn't sound like the one God will be placing us in a year or so.  

I hear so much teaching on Jesus in my IFB church on His compassion, mercy and grace it is unreal.  I wouldn't go to church if I didn't hear about Him.  God is, once again, building up my church.  People are coming to services.  My pastor is a very merciful man of God.  When we left our other IFB church, came back to our IFB church as visitors, I had a bad fall on the floor of my bedroom.  My husband and I were rushing to get somewhere.  I put on a new pair of shoes, and the wood from the heel of the shoe, hit the hard wood floor (I had washed the floor the day before, so it was still slippery) and I went down.  I had a compound fracture in my shoulder.  I dislocated it, and broke a good sized bone off.  My husband called EMS, because I couldn't make it, without going directly into the hospital without waiting.  Anyway, just as they gave me a shot of Morphine, my pastor (who wasn't even my pastor at the time) came in my hospital room.  He drove 40 minutes across town to tend to me.  I cried so much, b/c he took the time out of his hectic day to come and visit me.  I felt like God had walked into the room.  That is how special it felt to me.  If that isn't showing Jesus's love, compassion, mercy and grace, I don't know what is.  I also received a card from the church with a scripture in it, on healing.  I forget the scripture, but I remember it was from the Book of Jeremiah.  I cried tears of happiness when I read that card.  Again, showing the love of Jesus.  My church also prayed for me as I went through rehab for my shoulder.  It was a long process.

If you can, please private message me the IFB church that you used to attend.  That is, if they have a website.  I would like to look it over.  It sounds like you have been burned, and burned badly.  Just remember what I said about there never being a perfect church.  Man is not perfect, therefore His church isn't going to be perfect.  Also, stay away from things on OB if they make you upset.  If you don't like talking about prophecy, then don't take about it.  Don't even read it, in fact.  I caution you about Calvinism.  I know you are just getting you feet wet.  However, I believe you are walking down a road of confusion.  Try to remember the good things about you IFB church, too.  I am sure you can remember some things, if you don't harden your heart.  Pray for those people who upset you.  You may find that your anger will cease, b/c you have prayed for them.  

"But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you and persecute you." ~ Matthew 5:44   

Last but not least.  Never say never.  I remember, saying at a ladies' Bible study years back, that I would never leave my IFB church.  Shortly thereafter, we left and went to the other IFB church.  Thankfully, we did too.  My mother prOBably would have never got saved had we not attended that church.  She was already being grounded in God's word, but it was through that church she was saved.  My husband also attended the Bible Institute for three years there.  He will finish when we move down the south eastern, OH as that church also has a Bible Institute.

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Feel free, GP. No-one is being stopped from starting threads...


Exactly the point - but instead of doing so, he is doing precisely what he accuses us of doing...........
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