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Jordan Kurecki

Why The Hypocrisy?

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Nearly everyone of you commenting on this missed the very opening of this guys thread, because he was so sneaky about it: Read what  he said again:  

"Why is that we fundamentalists reject CCM because it uses the Rock and Roll beat" (emphasis added). The remainder of his reasons for calling the IFB hypocrites was irrelevant to what his opening premise was. As such, I already gave my answer above. 

 

If you don't like the music in the IFB church, then for God's sake and your pastors, please GET OUT before you cause any more division in that church, or before you end up "coming out" like the rest of CCM artists are doing right now.

Edited by Dr James Ach

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Perhaps it is the way that my brain processes what I read, but when I read the original post, I didn't get the impression that he was defending CCM, but rather, admonishing the acceptance of other genres with similar beats.

 

Understood the post the same way.

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Sometimes a brother that almost always dislikes anyone 'posting' here,

just can't live unless he causes division between people of like faith,

in casual conversations about things of life. Yes, Dr. Ach is at it again.

Just don't get 'personal' with him and he won't try to 'investigate' you and

try to destroy your testimony on here as a 'real' child of God. Meanwhile,

he never seems to really answer anything. He is vindictive and a 'hater' of

anything that goes against his beliefs. Even if we 'don't know better', he treats

us as if we were 'enemies' to the truth of Gods pure word. Not that we can't learn from him.

Maybe learn 'what not to be like'? How about reading beyond the first section of a sentence?

How about responding 'as if' the person questioning really is a Christian, and quit living so much

in the world of conspiracies, and actually fellowshipping amongst us, instead of over us.

It really makes one think of the verse,(in conspiratorial thinking of course) that truly the verse

that says, " As concerning the Gospel, they are enemies for your sakes..." 

Bet I get in trouble with this one.

Get that 'Bro' Ach? Who's סוֹכֵן are you?

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Why is that we fundamentalists reject CCM because it uses the Rock and Roll beat, yet we embrace Southern Gospel and other styles that use the same exact Piano Rhythms that were used in Ragtime, Swing and other early genres from the early 1900s.

 

Do a study on the history of the musical genres of Ragtime, Blues, Honkey Tonk, and Boogie Woogie.

 

I really am tired of this hypocrisy, you either must accept all genres as being valid, or you must reject all these other genres that borrow the worlds bar scene rhythms.

 

does 50 years passing by somehow make these genres and styles that were used to promote filth somehow make these now sanctified?

 

after studying and praying about music I've come to the conclusion that it's the rhythm of all these genres that connects them to immorality. 

 

Our young people and others are going to see through this hypocrisy and this is going to cause us to lose any right we have to preach against CCM.

 

You cannot preach against CCM and yet embrace Southern Gospel without being a hypocrite, and don't think just because the Southern Gospel you listen to doesn't have a drum beat and your ok, Even most of the Southern Gospel songs that don't have drums in them at all still have Ragtime Piano Rhythm. 

I'm trying to understand your purpose with this post. With the reply's that were mentioned, I was hoping that you would reply to some of the statements to clear things up, as there seems to be confusion with this post. Are you....
 
1) Saying you agreeing with fundamentalism that CCM is wrong, but tired of what you see as hypocrisy?
 
2) Just simply saying that you have an axe to grind with IFB?
 
3) Like CCM, but tired of IFB's not liking it but singing other songs similar to CCM?

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(My italics)

A poor choice of an expression. One would hope that there would be more care taken with Our Lord's Name than this.


I think he meant it in the true sense of the phrase, not the worldly sense.

And GP was shown to be a few things that he wished to hide by James - that's why he is so scathing of him.

I know who I would trust - James, and by a country mile too.

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I think he meant it in the true sense of the phrase, not the worldly sense.


I hope that you are right, but it was still a poor choice of phrase. In a publicly-viewable forum, our words should be chosen carefully to avoid confusion and to reflect our faith in a desirable light. We do not know who is OBserving and seeking out what we have.
 

And GP was shown to be a few things that he wished to hide by James - that's why he is so scathing of him.

I know who I would trust - James, and by a country mile too.


I do not care about others' personal squabbles that do not involve me. It is between the three of you.

Edited by Arbo

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I hope that you are right, but it was still a poor choice of phrase. In a publicly-viewable forum, our words should be chosen carefully to avoid confusion and to reflect our faith in a desirable light. We do not know who is OBserving and seeking out what we have.


I do not care about others' personal squabbles that do not involve me. It is between the three of you.


The second part was not directed at you - just added generally for clarity.
;)

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The second part was not directed at you - just added generally for clarity.
;)

 

It's only because that is all he will do is 'get personal'

and pick on people he disagrees with. He will only 'destroy' character, never edify.

Read his posts. They say it all.

 

He has shown his nature. The best wolf hunters, are wolves.

And he has plenty of my wool in his teeth.

Edited by Genevanpreacher

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Sometimes a brother that almost always dislikes anyone 'posting' here,

just can't live unless he causes division between people of like faith,

in casual conversations about things of life. Yes, Dr. Ach is at it again.

Just don't get 'personal' with him and he won't try to 'investigate' you and

try to destroy your testimony on here as a 'real' child of God. Meanwhile,

he never seems to really answer anything. He is vindictive and a 'hater' of

anything that goes against his beliefs. Even if we 'don't know better', he treats

us as if we were 'enemies' to the truth of Gods pure word. Not that we can't learn from him.

Maybe learn 'what not to be like'? How about reading beyond the first section of a sentence?

How about responding 'as if' the person questioning really is a Christian, and quit living so much

in the world of conspiracies, and actually fellowshipping amongst us, instead of over us.

It really makes one think of the verse,(in conspiratorial thinking of course) that truly the verse

that says, " As concerning the Gospel, they are enemies for your sakes..." 

Bet I get in trouble with this one.

Get that 'Bro' Ach? Who's סוֹכֵן are you?

Causes "division"? Have you lost your mind? Unless I missed something here, the sign on the door says "Independent Baptist-King James Only" and you and the OP BOTH came to this forum and immediately began posting things YOU KNEW would be controversial, or as you just said "DIVISIVE", and you have the audacity to accuse me of division? You can take your sorry and pathetic excuse for claiming to be a Christian or Baptist elsewhere because I am sick of you Jesuit infiltrating liars and hypocrites trying to pass off your self righteous piety here and then act like your excrement has a rosy fragrance (rosary, prOBably).

 

So yes, I "at it again" because I have to be. Somebody needs to keep the wolves out and rebuke them sharply because their mouths as Paul said MUST BE STOPPED.

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Causes "division"? Have you lost your mind? Unless I missed something here, the sign on the door says "Independent Baptist-King James Only" and you and the OP BOTH came to this forum and immediately began posting things YOU KNEW would be controversial, or as you just said "DIVISIVE", and you have the audacity to accuse me of division? You can take your sorry and pathetic excuse for claiming to be a Christian or Baptist elsewhere because I am sick of you Jesuit infiltrating liars and hypocrites trying to pass off your self righteous piety here and then act like your excrement has a rosy fragrance (rosary, prOBably).

 

So yes, I "at it again" because I have to be. Somebody needs to keep the wolves out and rebuke them sharply because their mouths as Paul said MUST BE STOPPED.

 

Please.

Waa, waa, waa... baby.

You betray your agenda.

 

I stand by what I said, since you sound like an idiot right now.

 

 Who's סוֹכֵן are you? Maybe this would be better - מי סוכן אתה?

Edited by Genevanpreacher

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It's only because that is all he will do is 'get personal'

and pick on people he disagrees with. He will only 'destroy' character, never edify.

Read his posts. They say it all.

 

He has shown his nature. The best wolf hunters, are wolves.

And he has plenty of my wool in his teeth.

And you are wrong. The best wolf hunters are not wolves, the best wolf hunter is a well trained human sharpshooter and trap setter.

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I often think James pushes a bit hard, and often tell him so privately by PM. He ALWAYS answers me graciously.
We do not always agree, but I respect him and he, by his answers, OBviously respects me.

He however is like a dog with a bone when it comes to exposing those who cause division - he will not let up.
And his research is faultless.

He certainly pulled up some things that some here did not want known.

I still think there are times when he should tread a little more softly, but I would never disagree with the path he treads.

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 The best wolf hunters, are wolves.

And he has plenty of my wool in his teeth.

 

 

I had to chuckle at this.  If James is hunting wolves, he is not going to have "wool" in his teeth.  That is, unless the wolf he has caught is disguising himself as a sheep.

Edited by Standing Firm In Christ

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These anti fundies act as if the "beat" is all we IFB harp on. Every day you read some new queer coming out who is a popular CCM musician (Like Ray Boltz who wrote "Thank You" sung in even some Baptist churches, or Michael Passons from Avalon who many conservative Christians thought was a "safe" Christian band-not only did Michael "come out" but Avalon's other singer, Melissa Greene, began endorsing the rap artist who made fun of the Bible at the Music Awards, and the band Jars of Clay recently came out of the closet). You have bands like Point of Grace and Stryper making secular albums and remaking secular songs, bands like Skillet who are now refusing to use the name "Christian", you have Calvinist groups like Caedmon's Call, Trinity rejecting groups like Philips Craig & Dean, Charismatic voodoo artists like Kare JOBe, Freemason and Illuminati members like Michael W. Smith, and women who divorce their husbands and marry other country artists like Amy Grant, and the rest are Catholic.

MUST I EXPLAIN FURTHER??

Thanks James I wasn't even aware of this. No further explanation required, I'll do the research. In my mostly rural area we don't see or hear much of this. Stimulating folks for door to door with the Gospel of Jesus Christ is my most daunting task. I'll begin a new route soon but, "the workers are few." 

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Not sure off the top of my head. I know the song but not sure if it's because we sing it, I remember it from childhood, or it's on one of my hymn CD's.

A mighty fortress is our God is a song written by Martin Luther using a victory song sung in beer pubs and festivals of the Germans.  Martin took the song changed some of the lyrics to teach sound doctrine to the people about God.

 

Today that song is in Baptist hymnal's and sung by every denomination.  and there are dozens of Songs like it.  some by Beethoven and Back both at best RC at worst plain pagan's yet hymns put to their music are sung in Baptist churches and other denominations to this date.

 

If we were to follow the example of Jesus and Paul singing without instruments is the way.  But how do you sing psalms and hymns without knowing the flow and beat of the musick?

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Why is that we fundamentalists reject CCM because it uses the Rock and Roll beat, yet we embrace Southern Gospel and other styles that use the same exact Piano Rhythms that were used in Ragtime, Swing and other early genres from the early 1900s.

 

 

Do we? My church doesn't. I know some certainly do - but please don't paint with such a broad brush.

 

Reallyn did you know that Gaither's song "because he lives" found in many Hymnals is done with Southern Gospel styled music and many IFB churches play it that way. 

 

We do not have that in our hymnal, or in any hymnals I've seen in the IFB churches around here. The song is present in the large-print songbook used by the local seniors homes - should anyone request that piece, I do not play it Southern Gospel style. Your brush is also a little broad. 

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A mighty fortress is our God is a song written by Martin Luther using a victory song sung in beer pubs and festivals of the Germans.  Martin took the song changed some of the lyrics to teach sound doctrine to the people about God.

 

Today that song is in Baptist hymnal's and sung by every denomination.  and there are dozens of Songs like it.  some by Beethoven and Back both at best RC at worst plain pagan's yet hymns put to their music are sung in Baptist churches and other denominations to this date.

 

If we were to follow the example of Jesus and Paul singing without instruments is the way.  But how do you sing psalms and hymns without knowing the flow and beat of the musick?

Study out what a 'bar tune' is.  (By the way, its NOT a tune sung in a bar) 

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Please.

Waa, waa, waa... baby.

You betray your agenda.

 

I stand by what I said, since you sound like an idiot right now.

 

 Who's סוֹכֵן are you? Maybe this would be better - מי סוכן אתה?

That'll be enough of that, sir. Keep it civil. We can disagree and still not stoop to Waa waa baby junk.

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