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So How Does A Person Get Saved?


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I know a person who is IFB and his testimony is that he was a devout Catholic until invited to an IFB and was so impressed with how people in the church brought their bibles and knew where to turn when the pastor said turn in your bibles to....
That was it, I guess he said he was saved and is a Christian. No confessing to god his sins, no experience of being freed from his former life. He was always devout, so I guess he just found the "right" church. Did he become a new creature as the bible says?

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If he cannot recall a single point in time where he was hearing or reading the Gospel (death, burial and resurrection of Jesus) preached, felt an undeniable conviction of sin, God's righteousness and judgment to come and at this point changed his entire outlook on God calling out to God to save him, then No, he is not born again. He is just one of many tares within IFB churches.

 

His story however is less common than what I think is the most common tare in IFB churches though.

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There are saved people in the Catholic Church.  The Holy Spirit is free to work anywhere.  False teaching is prevalent even in so-called Baptist Churches.  Matter of fact, I'd say that 4th Century Catholic Replacement Theology (or remnants thereof) is becoming dominant even in Baptist Churches.

Edited by beameup
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Wretched,

 

You have piqued my curiosity. Is there a "common tare" in IFB churches, or was your statement more general in nature?

 

I think the common tare are the 2nd generation members. Those who were converted as children, growing up in the church and never actually repented since their only knowledge of the Lord was from their parents.

I fear for these kids and cringe when I see parents encouraging their children to pray a prayer to be saved.

They look, act, talk just like the born again but never actually were. Just a theory

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I hear what you're saying, but technically 'praying a prayer' is a perfectly good way of bring saved - so long as it's not the prayer you're depending in. And small children can repent as well as older ones. If they were converted as kids, they are and remain converted.

I know there are some who talk-the-talk without ever getting saved , and I assume it's those you're speaking of. But it's a good thing when children get saved young!

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Consider this and I will leave it alone:

 

Jesus said we must have the faith of a child, Jesus said forbid not the children for of such is the Kingdom. I don't believe it is possible for a child to be born again so soon after water birth. I think they are safe not having their own opinions yet. It is when they turn from their parents and influence-rs opinions in their early teens and form their own that it is possible for them to repent.

 

I think we should absolutely sow the seeds and keep them in church of course. But I don't think we should push them to be "saved" when they have no true conviction of what they are doing. And as they grow continue to convince them they got saved when they were 5 or 8 or 10 or whatever when they reach their teens and are having doubts and then when they reach their 20s, etc.

 

Sow the seeds, when they are old they will not depart from it (not forget the seeds as they are watered). They will truly repent then. I don't have time to thoroughly explain my idea but there it is in a nutshell.

 

I know it is not what you hear in sunday school but it is a concern of mine.

 

Real quick, run an experiment in children's church when a child is confronted to be saved. Offer candy at the point of prayer instead and see what they decide.

 

You could have offered me a million dollars instead at the point where I got saved and I would have lit your money on fire. Think about it.

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Just remember that repentance is a change of mind, not some huge feeling or action. Children can definitely have that change of understanding. I agree that sometimes kids are pushed to be. 'Saved ' when they have no true understanding or desire - saw a bad invitation like that in a children's church once myself - not good! However, if a child is old enough to choose to sin and to understand and trust the gospel , why should he not be old enough to be saved?

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With our children, I waited for them to ask me about being saved. I simply taught them the Gospel.

There has come a time in each of their lives, where they had great sorrow, a fear of Hell, a belief that Jesus died substitutionally, that He is the Creator, and a desire to be saved.

Anishinaabe

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While I do believe children can be saved, and I know some folks who were saved as children, Wretched does bring up a good point with regards to trying to "force" children into a quick profession rather than awaiting the timing and leading of the Holy Spirit. There seems to be a lot of people who thought they were saved as a child simply because they agreed to say a "sinners prayer". They were, at that point, focused upon the prayer, not upon actual biblical salvation.

 

Thankfully some of these do eventually come to realize they were never born again and do come to Christ later in life, but many never do. Some eventually drop away while others remain in the church still lost but clinging to "the prayer" they repeated as a child with the false hope that's going to get them into heaven.

 

Hopefully it doesn't happen in all churches, but I know of some where parents almost compete to see how young they can get their children to "repeat after me" so they can claim they are saved. Not only do parents compete in this way, but some actually put effort into being able to say they got their child "saved" younger than did this or that family.

 

We have to be careful not to rush ahead of the Holy Ghost in these matters. If the Holy Ghost has prepared a child's heart for being born again, it will happen. If the Holy Ghost has not yet done so with a child. pushing them into repeating a "prayer" will only serve to confuse and possibly even hinder the child from actually being born again.

 

Facebook is very telling of such things as one can look up the profiles of many young adults who "said a prayer" as a child, claimed to be saved, grew up in the church, but as soon as they got to college their true hearts show forth. Their profile pictures, friends, and other pictures show them engaged in all manner of unchristian practices.

 

When a child truly comes to Christ, that's a blessed event and much to be praised. When a child is rushed to "repeat a prayer" and then declared saved based upon that alone, there is potential for great danger at hand.

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John, on that point I do agree with Wretched. I prOBably should have quoted the part I completely disagreed with. I'll do that now:

 

 

Jesus said we must have the faith of a child, Jesus said forbid not the children for of such is the Kingdom. I don't believe it is possible for a child to be born again so soon after water birth. I think they are safe not having their own opinions yet. It is when they turn from their parents and influence-rs opinions in their early teens and form their own that it is possible for them to repent.

 

 

THAT is what I took issue with. Young children are perfectly capable of forming their own ideas and understanding the concepts of life, death, punishments/consequences, salvation, etc.... I do believe in the "age of accountability", but I don't think there is an actual "age" attached to it, it has to do with the maturity level of the child. 

 

The plan of salvation is very simple. Many people believe it's too simple, but God made it simple on purpose, it's accessible and understandable to everyone, man, woman, and child. To deny someone the plan of salvation based on their age is wrong. 

 

Now, I do agree with the other points made. To manipulate a child (or anyone else for that matter) into saying a prayer is wrong. Salvation is a personal experience, only that individual can make the choice, they should not be manipulated or pressured into that choice. Jesus never forced anyone to become a Christian, just like the rich young ruler, He let them walk away if they chose.

Edited by 利百加 (Li Bai Jia)
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I know a person who is IFB and his testimony is that he was a devout Catholic until invited to an IFB and was so impressed with how people in the church brought their bibles and knew where to turn when the pastor said turn in your bibles to....
That was it, I guess he said he was saved and is a Christian. No confessing to god his sins, no experience of being freed from his former life. He was always devout, so I guess he just found the "right" church. Did he become a new creature as the bible says?

 

Highly unlikely according to the information presented.  "I guess he said he was saved" is not even definite.  By your description, this fella just found a building with people in it he likes better than the old building and people in it.

 

When God saved me, I didn't understand or could not articulate it but I knew I was saved.  On June 13, 2007 right around 2:30 in the afternoon I was out on my porch balcony and I simply gave up, told the Lord I was done resisting and realized that I could no longer succeed on my own, that what I'd been doing and living was wrong and turned my life over to him.  There's your Acts 20:21.

 

I didn't understand until years later how His death on the cross saved me (seems so simple now), I didn't stop cursing like a sailor or viewing pornography right away and did become anti-abortion in an instant.  I went out and bought a bible and started reading it and immediately began attending church and soaking in all things christian, especially on television.  There's your Phil 4:2.  That's an NIV bible, Catholic church and Charles Stanley and the 700 Club.  Talk about piling error upon error!  I didn't know a single Christian and nOBody witnessed to me.  Well there's more, but I reckon it's not unlike most folks here who later became Independent Baptists too.

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With my six children I never pressured one to be saved, all six were raised in the church and a loving christian home,.today each one has been saved but not of my will, but of the lords will and the conviction of the Holly Spirit and Praising the Lord for answering our prayers is our joy    

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Highly unlikely according to the information presented.  "I guess he said he was saved" is not even definite.  By your description, this fella just found a building with people in it he likes better than the old building and people in it.

 

When God saved me, I didn't understand or could not articulate it but I knew I was saved.  On June 13, 2007 right around 2:30 in the afternoon I was out on my porch balcony and I simply gave up, told the Lord I was done resisting and realized that I could no longer succeed on my own, that what I'd been doing and living was wrong and turned my life over to him.  There's your Acts 20:21.

 

I didn't understand until years later how His death on the cross saved me (seems so simple now), I didn't stop cursing like a sailor or viewing pornography right away and did become anti-abortion in an instant.  I went out and bought a bible and started reading it and immediately began attending church and soaking in all things christian, especially on television.  There's your Phil 4:2.  That's an NIV bible, Catholic church and Charles Stanley and the 700 Club.  Talk about piling error upon error!  I didn't know a single Christian and nOBody witnessed to me.  Well there's more, but I reckon it's not unlike most folks here who later became Independent Baptists too.

 

Please rewind for just a moment friend. Is this your actual testimony? What you just described on june 13, 2007 is a resolution and not a new birth. Without the Gospel and conviction of the Spirit from hearing the

Gospel, there is no new birth period.

You mention nothing of the Gospel being preached to you, nothing of seeds sown in the past, nothing of previous witnesses, relatives, anyone?

Was there ever a time after this that you answered the Spirit's call by the Gospel? I am not second guessing or challenging you but this is important my friend.

If you were just summarizing quickly and there is more leading up to the event in 2007, then I apologize.

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All that matters is who and what you are trusting in now to get you into heaven. It doesn't matter about some salvation experience in the past and whether you can remember all the details or not (I can't). What matters is who you are trusting at this precise moment. 

 

It doesn't matter about a prayer, conviction, feeling of guilt or being lost, or memory of a specific time and place, etc, etc. If you are NOW trusting in the Lord Jesus Christ and his precious blood ONLY then you are in.

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No consensus here on how one is saved and all say the bible says this and that. God uses different means but all through Christ. But there has to be knowledge of the new birth, a point where a person has been born again. If we love God then we love others. You can't make the bible tell you that you are saved, for it is something that the Holy spirit does In your heart.

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Please rewind for just a moment friend. Is this your actual testimony? What you just described on june 13, 2007 is a resolution and not a new birth. Without the Gospel and conviction of the Spirit from hearing the

Gospel, there is no new birth period.

You mention nothing of the Gospel being preached to you, nothing of seeds sown in the past, nothing of previous witnesses, relatives, anyone?

Was there ever a time after this that you answered the Spirit's call by the Gospel? I am not second guessing or challenging you but this is important my friend.

If you were just summarizing quickly and there is more leading up to the event in 2007, then I apologize.

 

No, on that day I made repentance toward God and put my faith in Jesus Christ.

 

There is more, some time earlier my wife had given to me the book, The Case for Christ, I read it to disprove once and for all God and the bible.  I didn't win and thank heavens for that!

 

My only memory of someone witnessing to me (the exact conversation is lost, don't even know if it was biblical) was at the BEQ lounge at Glenview Naval Air Station in the summer of 1986.  That night a former sailor and wanderer told me he traveled the country going wherever the Lord needed him to go.  He talked to me about the Lord but I soon changed the topic.  I was the chief mocker of all things God in my family, though while in uniform I faked it.  Used to make sport out of running those anti-abortion people off the sidewalks with my muscle car; it's a miracle that God chose to forgive all that I had done against him and still keeps my name in the book despite all the wrongs I continue to do.  Were there others?  I cannot remember, there were certainly some I never gave a second's worth of my time to try though.  

 

Just as the savage in the jungle is responsible to God, my salvation was similar.

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No consensus here on how one is saved and all say the bible says this and that. God uses different means but all through Christ. But there has to be knowledge of the new birth, a point where a person has been born again. If we love God then we love others. You can't make the bible tell you that you are saved, for it is something that the Holy spirit does In your heart.

 

There certainly is a consensus Donillo.  We are saved by grace, by making repentance towards God and putting our faith in, turning our lives over to Jesus Christ.  There is no work we can do to get into heaven, none of deserve it, our best works are as filthy rags.  There is none righteous, no not one.  We are only righteous through the blood of Jesus Christ and only once has made repentance towards God and put his faith in the Savior.

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Interesting question.

 

But I think you have to back up a minute.  What does salvation mean?  This is something I am not sure I entirely know the answer to.  When I was a child, I was taught a person is saved by saying a prayer repeated after a preacher or friend.  I now no longer believe that.  Salvation is much more complex.  I do not think it is a one time thing, but an on going process.  To start the process, one must make a decision to become a disciple or follower of Jesus.  But God will work on them throughout their entire lives. 

 

So what does it mean that one "got saved?"  I honestly do not know.  I really hate that term.  I prefer to say once made a decision to follow or become a disciple of Jesus. 

 

Yes, a single event is part of salvation.  Even children raised in the church, such as my own, who follow Jesus as far as they can understand, will have to decide to become a disciple on their own.  Right now, I have planted them in fertile soil and hope that faith takes root. It very well might.  I have a friend who is a clear follower of Jesus who never remembers not believing.  It was something he grew into and at some point decided to make his own.  So when was he saved?  I don't know but I do know he is a follower of Jesus.  I had another friend in college who grew into faith during a summer when he took a New Testament class.  He did not "pray a prayer," but there was undoubtedly a change.  Yet one of my good friends who "prayed a prayer" at 9 years old is not a follower of Christ and is a self proclaimed agnostic today.  so salvation is a very complicated thing. 

 

Yet it is so simple as well.

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Interesting question.

 

But I think you have to back up a minute.  What does salvation mean?  This is something I am not sure I entirely know the answer to.  When I was a child, I was taught a person is saved by saying a prayer repeated after a preacher or friend.  I now no longer believe that.  Salvation is much more complex.  I do not think it is a one time thing, but an on going process.  To start the process, one must make a decision to become a disciple or follower of Jesus.  But God will work on them throughout their entire lives. 

 

So what does it mean that one "got saved?"  I honestly do not know.  I really hate that term.  I prefer to say once made a decision to follow or become a disciple of Jesus. 

 

Yes, a single event is part of salvation.  Even children raised in the church, such as my own, who follow Jesus as far as they can understand, will have to decide to become a disciple on their own.  Right now, I have planted them in fertile soil and hope that faith takes root. It very well might.  I have a friend who is a clear follower of Jesus who never remembers not believing.  It was something he grew into and at some point decided to make his own.  So when was he saved?  I don't know but I do know he is a follower of Jesus.  I had another friend in college who grew into faith during a summer when he took a New Testament class.  He did not "pray a prayer," but there was undoubtedly a change.  Yet one of my good friends who "prayed a prayer" at 9 years old is not a follower of Christ and is a self proclaimed agnostic today.  so salvation is a very complicated thing. 

 

Yet it is so simple as well.

 

I'm so sorry to hear you say this KOB.

 

Man has made the Gospel complex and wrong by adding works to it.  

 

The moment a person makes repentance towards God and puts their trust in Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit immediately indwells them and their name is written in the book of life.  They cannot lose their salvation.

 

Salvation is NOT a process, sanctification is.

 

Now what does "repentance" (in the context of salvation) and "faith" (in the context of salvation) mean?

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13For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

14How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

15And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

16But they have not all OBeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

17So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.   Romans 10:13-17

 

Salvation in a nutshell. Someone must go and preach, so the lost can hear and believe. Even with Paul, Jesus Himself went and preached to him, so to speak. And when they believe, they call for salvation and are saved.

 

Just "praying a prayer' is not it. Calling upon the Lord IS a part of it, but so is belief, and know WHAT to believe. Don't got to know everything, clearly, but even the proverbial child k nows when they have done wrong and that punishment will come if things are not made right. That's why I remember my sister, as a child, smacking my brother in the head right in front of my father, then running up to my father and saying, "I love you, daddy!". She knew she was in trouble and was trying, vainly, to make it right before punishment fell. So we must know who God is, know why we are in trouble and what has been done about it, so we can seek forgiveness and salvation. A single event, though growth is a life-long thing.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist
For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received,
how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day
according to the scriptures:  1 Corinthians 15:3-4

 

Christ died for OUR sins (took them upon himself)

and then ROSE from the dead (satisfying God).

When you first know this, then you have to make a "decision".

Either you recognize God's forgiveness and apply it to yourself, or your sin remains "upon yourself".

The "ego" must "die", or your pride will prevent you from receiving forgivness and eternal life.

Edited by beameup
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No, on that day I made repentance toward God and put my faith in Jesus Christ.

 

There is more, some time earlier my wife had given to me the book, The Case for Christ, I read it to disprove once and for all God and the bible.  I didn't win and thank heavens for that!

 

My only memory of someone witnessing to me (the exact conversation is lost, don't even know if it was biblical) was at the BEQ lounge at Glenview Naval Air Station in the summer of 1986.  That night a former sailor and wanderer told me he traveled the country going wherever the Lord needed him to go.  He talked to me about the Lord but I soon changed the topic.  I was the chief mocker of all things God in my family, though while in uniform I faked it.  Used to make sport out of running those anti-abortion people off the sidewalks with my muscle car; it's a miracle that God chose to forgive all that I had done against him and still keeps my name in the book despite all the wrongs I continue to do.  Were there others?  I cannot remember, there were certainly some I never gave a second's worth of my time to try though.  

 

Just as the savage in the jungle is responsible to God, my salvation was similar.

 

Ah, got it bro, thanks. KInd reply too.

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No consensus here on how one is saved and all say the bible says this and that. God uses different means but all through Christ. But there has to be knowledge of the new birth, a point where a person has been born again. If we love God then we love others. You can't make the bible tell you that you are saved, for it is something that the Holy spirit does In your heart.

l John 5:13  These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

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I agree that many children are forced into salvation.  I have seen it in my church.  I remember my niece, going to the altar, after an invitation by an evangelist, remaining kneeling at the altar.  One of the woman went to the altar to pray with her.  My FIL had good intentions, but he asked this woman, "Did she get saved, did she get saved?"   The woman said, "No.  She didn't put her faith and trust in Jesus Christ."  My niece was very young.  Several years later, her younger brother professed to be saved.  Then, she immediately said that she was saved.  I watch them in church.  Neither of them take a song book to sing.  Neither of them take their Bibles to church.  I truly do not think they are saved.  I believe it was sibling rivalry with them.  My nephew decided he would say he got saved, then his older sister followed.

In the IFB church that I was a member of for 4 years, they don't push salvation upon the children.  They wait patiently on the Holy Spirit to do His jOB.  Many of those children were in their teenage years before they got saved.  However, they show fruits of their salvation and they also know the way to get to heaven is by faith in Jesus Christ.

I have talked with my pastor's wife about how many church members push the children into salvation, when they aren't convicted of the Holy Spirit.  Many teenagers and adults, in my church, have come forward years later, and confessed they needed to know Christ as Personal Saviour.  Well meaning parents and grandparents should step back and let the Holy Spirit work, rather than pushing the Spirit.

This takes me back to when I thought I was saved in 1998.  A Baptist friend had me say the "Sinners Prayer."  I thought I was saved.  I bought a KJV Bible and began to read and study it.  I began witnessing to people, as well.  It wasn't until I gained head knowledge in my church that I was saved May 10, 2003 (Mother's Day Weekend) in the hospital after an Epileptic Seizure.  I told everyone I came into contact with that weekend, in my hospital bed, that I was a born again Christian.  I also chased away a few doctors who came to check on me.  The hospital finally sent in a former Baptist preacher to talk to me.  We prayed together and the Holy Spirit reassured me of my salvation.      

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Our wayward son was in attendance at an evangelistic service when he was 16 or 17 and I do believe he was under Holy Ghost conviction but he was fighting it. The helpers (I don't recall what they actually called them) who spoke with him afterward used a good deal of emotional appeal with him and talked him into saying a "sinners prayer" and proclaimed him saved.

 

Afterward he said all the right things but something to me didn't seem right, though I hoped for the best. It didn't take long before the emotion of it all wore off and it was evident there had been no repentance, no change of heart, no surrendering to Christ. He once again told me the same thing he had told me on previous occasions when I had shared the Gospel with him and talked with him about it. Unfortunately, that's still his position today.

 

According to our wayward son, he does believe Jesus is who the Bible says He is and does believe Jesus is the only way of salvation, being right with God, going to heaven, avoiding hell, etc. He claims he would like to follow Jesus but he wants the things of the world, he doesn't want to deny his flesh, he wants to do what he wants to do.

 

We continue to pray for him, of course, but it is looking as if this will be a long battle. Since he's moved out he's shown no interest at all in the things of God. No interest in the Bible (when he moved out he left his Bible here, claiming he didn't have room to pack it, yet he found room to pack some snow boots someone had given him...he moved to Florida, no need for snow boots there; and as we know, always a need for the Bible) and he's not interested in finding a church to attend.

 

One of the nearby churches often pushes getting children and youth "saved and baptized" but it's not biblical salvation, and depending upon who the current pastor happens to be (they go through a lot of pastors), sometimes they are teaching that baptism is necessary for salvation. I've seen so many go through that church, grow up in that church, "get saved and baptized" and as soon as they are out of the house and off to college they are dressing immodestly, getting drunk, sleeping around, and yet they are under the false belief they are good with God and most often their parents believe that too.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

If he cannot recall a single point in time where he was hearing or reading the Gospel (death, burial and resurrection of Jesus) preached, felt an undeniable conviction of sin, God's righteousness and judgment to come and at this point changed his entire outlook on God calling out to God to save him, then No, he is not born again. He is just one of many tares within IFB churches.

 

His story however is less common than what I think is the most common tare in IFB churches though.

 

Wow! Didn't think it was such a difficult thing to become a believer in Jesus Christ. Let's see, how many steps was there? 5?

Edited by Genevanpreacher
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I have a testimony of a lady who had been a member of her church for 50 years and had witnessed to the lost and did many other great things in the church thinking for many years that she was saved. one Sunday her church had a visiting pastor that preached on salvation, the Holly Spirit begin to convict her heart and when the pastor gave the alter call she came forward and trusted Jesus as her savior, she was 85 years old , her testimony is a bible tract which I gave out for a while and I'm looking to see if I have anymore left and if I do I'll try and post it hear, it's a blessing and well worth the time to read for the many whom may think they're saved by works.

 

God bless   

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I have a testimony of a lady who had been a member of her church for 50 years and had witnessed to the lost and did many other great things in the church thinking for many years that she was saved. one Sunday her church had a visiting pastor that preached on salvation, the Holly Spirit begin to convict her heart and when the pastor gave the alter call she came forward and trusted Jesus as her savior, she was 85 years old , her testimony is a bible tract which I gave out for a while and I'm looking to see if I have anymore left and if I do I'll try and post it hear, it's a blessing and well worth the time to read for the many whom may think they're saved by works.

 

God bless   

 

I suspect brother Smith that there may be a few currently on this site who have no clear testimony of their new birth.

 

Without recollection of a single point in time where they clearly heard the Gospel and OBEYED the Gospel, calling out to God to save them and afterward realized a new life, outlook and vision of the world...then they were never born again and are very religious and very lost.

 

Oh they understand very well with their heads and can hold their own in any discussion of the Word, they are still lost. The world is full of people who believe in the Lord Jesus Christ but they never as of yet have believed ON Him.

 

If this post saddens, upsets or angers you, you best stop what you are doing and search yourself..you may be a tare. What, do you think the tares our Lord refers to know they are tares? This is why I post this.

 

No apologies on this post and this one is not opinion and is authoritative. "having a form of Godliness but denying the POWER thereof". The POWER is the new birth.

 

You can have everything locked in your head, you can know more than all, but without the new birth it will equal damnation.

 

I suspect there are vast numbers who have simply adopted fundamental Bible Christianity over time as their "religion".  They have worked at it, learned it and OBeyed Jesus's teachings and the Apostles as best anyone could but were NEVER born again. If this is you than you are lost and without hope. You simply chose or fell into or inherited fundamental Bible Christianity as your religion instead of catholicism or islam or Mormonism, etc. 

BUT IT IS NEVER TOO LATE WHILE YOU STILL BREATH.

 

Think about it.

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If this post saddens, upsets or angers you, you best stop what you are doing and search yourself..you may be a tare. What, do you think the tares our Lord refers to know they are tares? This is why I post this.

 

 

Whoah. I get what you're saying, but to say that if someone disagrees with your post they better make sure they're really saved is rather presumptuous, eh?

 

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