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AVBibleBeliever

How Old Is The Earth

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The Bible does not say that Earth was created in Eternity. Time began in verse 1.

In the beginning...
Beginning of what?
Beginning of time.
In the beginning, God created...

Verses 1-5 are all part of the first paragraph in the story of creation.

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Gen,

 

God established the 24/7 time encapsulation for man in Genesis 1:3-5.  and then placed it in a firmament to which that time works well for man after his creation.  God created the 24/7 before he set the sun and moon in revolution around the earth.  

 

Anytime existence before that is known in scriptures as eternity, eternal, from everlasting to everlasting.   It is said that the high and lofty one inhabits eternity that means from beginning to end (hence the alpha and Omega identification in scriptures) of it this is why he is eternal and why he can be everywhere and know all things.  That is because he is the almighty God.

 

Both David and Peter say a day is as of a thousand years.  they both speak from within the 24/7 time quantum to express something they did not understand at that time in their earthly existence, which is eternity.

 

I do not deny the existence of a time quantum before the 24/7.  But our current time quantum of the 24/7 was established in Gen 1:3-5 on day one of God's six days of work.  god's time quantum is from everlasting to everlasting.

 

You will notice in the scripture below, preserved for us in Gods word that the Earth and the World were two separate creations.

 

 Ps 90:2 Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever thou hadst formed the earth and the world, even from everlasting to everlasting, thou art God.

 

And I agree, with exception to your reference to Gen. 1:3-5, of course. Although verse one and two are the 'subject starter' of 3-5.

So what is your reasoning with this answer?

Did I say anything contrary to your logic?

If I did, I don't see it.

Your view of Psalm 90:2, is interesting. But I don't see 2 creations here.

That's like saying 'the land of America', yet saying it's two different things. Land, and America.

That verse is just explaining the length of time that God has been Moses's God.

And the reference to "earth and the world" is just saying the original 'composition' [without form, and void] of earth before God separated it into 'all things', and after he separated it into 'all things' that we now see as the Earth.

Edited by Genevanpreacher

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And I agree, with exception to your reference to Gen. 1:3-5, of course. Although verse one and two are the 'subject starter' of 3-5.  subject starter yes but actual time line no.  verse two is the actual time line starter.  Gen 1:1 is the forming of the earth and Gen1:2 is the starting point of the forming of the world in which we live currently.

So what is your reasoning with this answer?  From Everlasting is a time standard we do no relate too.  but the 24/7 is within our understanding because it was established on day one of the six days of the work of God.

Did I say anything contrary to your logic?

If I did, I don't see it.

Your view of Psalm 90:2, is interesting. But I don't see 2 creations here.  Two beginnings would be more like it not two creations. one from everlasting one at the six days of the work of God.

That's like saying 'the land of America', yet saying it's two different things. Land, and America.  No it is not the same as your analogy

That verse is just explaining the length of time that God has been Moses's God.  Moses was given Genesis by revelation from God

And the reference to "earth and the world" is just saying the original 'composition' [without form, and void] of earth before God separated it into 'all things', and after he separated it into 'all things' that we now see as the Earth.  "without from and void" can be determined by the Bibles uses of God's words as preserved for us The second and only other use of "without form and void" speaks of Jerusalem (more specifically the temple mount, once built and established then being without form and void when they were taken into captivity by babylon. To say that "without form and void" means that no previous form existed is not in alignment with the word of God in how he uses "without form and void" concerning Israel, Jerusalem.  Either We believe God has given us the meaning of his words in the book that contains all his words or we have to go to some other source to determine what He means.  I choose to believe God's definition over any contrived meaning by men.

Edited by AVBibleBeliever

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I chose to believe in a gap.  If you do not agree that is fine but let's not attack each other for my personal view.  the issue of a Gap is a non-essential issue and is of no cause to divide or hurt our relationship as Christians.

 

Wow! I wish all here would read this again and again!

Let's not attack each other.

Thank you AVBB!

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What is funny, is the attempt to put time in eternity. The foolishness of saying Earth existed in eternity, just a day or two before creation is ludicrous... to say the least.

You are saying 'Days existed before days existed'. RoFL

No, if Earth existed in eternity, then the Earth has always been in existence. But the Bible says it was made in the six-day creation period. I'll stick with the Bible.

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Seems to me that, for there to be any gap, it ewould have to add to the days given in Gen chapter one. For there to have been an earth for life to exist on, there would have to be a sun and moon and atmosphere, etc. I don't know whether the gap being expounded above is the version that has Lucifer reigning over a proto-human race, as well as being the place the dinosaurs fit in, and then, when they all died in the great pre-deluge deluge, leaving us all the fossils, but if it IS, then its impossible, because it would, indeed, have to be another entire earth. if God destroyed everything, including all life, then this is another earth, unlike the flood of Noah, from which the Lord saved a remnant both of men and animals, thus it being the same earth, just judged.

 

However, the Bible calls this earth the first earth, and later, the new heavens and Earth, the second earth. As well, if there was life, then there had to be an entire creation, thus, days and nights, and so, the count given in genesis 1 must be incorrect-it could Not be THE first day, or THE second day. Maybe then the new bversions have it right, where it says, "a day" and "another day". THAT would fit a gap, because 'a day' could contextually apply to anything.

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In reference to a comment made earlier, I have to say that belief in a Gap Theory is not a non-essential. If the classically-accepted Gap Theory is correct, then we have death occurring before sin. Since the Bible states that death is a consequence of sin, this idea would have serious consequences on our soteriology.

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In reference to a comment made earlier, I have to say that belief in a Gap Theory is not a non-essential. If the classically-accepted Gap Theory is correct, then we have death occurring before sin. Since the Bible states that death is a consequence of sin, this idea would have serious consequences on our soteriology.

AND the Bible says that sin came by man, specifcally Adam. We know that Lucifer, the devil, sinned and tempted Eve, but it was Adam that brought sin into the world, and the world, including the earth, suffered for it. Sin by man, and death by sin, salvation by Christ. No room for sin or judgment before that.  

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we know it 2014 yr in the new testamant and we know that jOB live between 1485 and 1445 and that the oldest book in the bible and their was 77 generation between adam and christ that would make it about 4000 yrs i hope that helps

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I do not believe in a 'Lucifer', as pertaining to some 'high angelic being' over one third of the angels.

I know I will get opposition on this, but to 'create' an existence of a creature that man has added

the attributes and 'honor' that only our Lord should have, but from the opposite view of course, in my opinion

is just wrong.

Historically the name Lucifer, in whatever language spoken, was meant to name the planet we call Venus. I do not get this from modern sources.

The notes alone in my bible explain this name as meaning "the morning star, that goeth before the sun, is called lucifer to whom Nebuchadnezzar is compared"

I go to work at 5:30 am everyday, and most days I get to see that morning star: Venus. By the way, sometimes it is the 'evening star' too. 

Yes, some 'non-Baptists' in centuries of old, did refer Lucifer's one verse in Isaiah as an example of the devil we call Satan.

But their thoughtline was based on and in their other 'doctrines'. Which we know as unbiblical. Why Baptists have taken this up I do not know

But I do know that, as a bible believing Baptist, and I am one, that no matter what any other 'baptist' teacher or preacher says,

you go on scripture, and the scripture does not teach Lucifer as the Head Devil of biblical teaching. It is a made up doctrine using other verses

that appear to support it yet don't clearly.

Jesus Christ never once named the devil Lucifer. He referred him to other names, of which we all know.

I have received plenty of 'flack' concerning this thought, yet is it destructive to our beliefs at all?

I don't think so.

 

.....cut......

 

Isaiah 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! (The remaining paragraph.) 13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit. They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;17 That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; that opened not the house of his prisoners? All the kings of the nations, even all of them, lie in glory, every one in his own house. 19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet. 20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned. 21 Prepare slaughter for his children for the iniquity of their fathers; that they do not rise, nor possess the land, nor fill the face of the world with cities.

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Isaiah 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! (The remaining paragraph.) 13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit. They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;17 That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; that opened not the house of his prisoners? All the kings of the nations, even all of them, lie in glory, every one in his own house. 19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet. 20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned. 21 Prepare slaughter for his children for the iniquity of their fathers; that they do not rise, nor possess the land, nor fill the face of the world with cities.

 

 

So, what's your point here. You quoted, now explain why.

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I think the passage is pretty clear myself..........

 

Especially in reference to your previous words that he quoted.

 

The Bible certainly seems to disagree with you - and that is without any reference to any other doctrines from any other source.........

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I think the passage is pretty clear myself..........

 

Especially in reference to your previous words that he quoted.

 

The Bible certainly seems to disagree with you - and that is without any reference to any other doctrines from any other source.........

 

Once again, there is no Biblical proof at all that this is referring to a 'head devil'. The subject of this section of scripture is Nebuchadnezzar, not Satan.

People wanna lift up "Lucifer" to the point that he has prophetic verses 'talking' about him, like people can read about the prophetic verses about the Lord Jesus in O.T., and 'add'

to Satan's abilities Godlike references as to his 'power' before he was Satan.

The only way to 'prove' Satan was an angelic being called Lucifer is to add to God's word a 'gap theory'.

Hence, false teaching.

 

Where is any other record in scripture that Lucifer was/is/ever shall be a devil at all?

 

I don't think this is an important 'doctrine' that we should focus our beliefs around, yet the minds of Baptists looking for 'exciting things' hidden in scripture

love this kinda stuff, and miss out on the facts of scripture. Conspiracy theorists do the same thing.

Edited by Genevanpreacher

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