Jump to content
  • Welcome Guest

    For an ad free experience on Online Baptist, Please login or register for free

Daniel & Revelation - The Indepth Study Thread, Bring Your Bibles Please.


Recommended Posts

  • Members
One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.  Romans 14:5
 
There are no "special" or "holy" days to those who are under the Gospel of Grace.
To those, like religious Jews under the Law, there is a "Sabbath" observance.
The 613 commandments are straight from the Old Testament (Torah),
anyone who says otherwise is a LIAR (every orthodox Jew knows this).
 

 

For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.  James 2:10
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 92
  • Created
  • Last Reply
  • Moderators

I have moved this topic to False Religions. I have done this because this is clearly staed a Baptist Board, made up of, and for, Independent Funadamental Baptists. Anyone may join and partake, of course, but there will be no Bible Studies based upon Seventh Day Adventist doctrines, any more than there will be of Mormonism, or jehovah's Witnesses or anything else that we would classify clearly as a false religion, except in this forum.

 

No offense meant to anyone, particularly Banner Over Me Was Love-you have generally been kind in your dealings and polite, so it is not meant as a swipe at you. It was done for the sake of the board as a whole.

 

Carry on.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

You do of course realise that In

Dan 8:14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

The word days can not possibly mean years.

The words days is translated from two Hebrew words, the first of which means evening and the second of which means morning.

In this instance these two words are compounded, indicating that they are a single concept - an "evening-morning".

There is no possibility in the Hebrew that this phrase can be applied to anything other than days - certainly not to years.

Bill Miller was wrong about that, Ellie White blindly followed in his error, as do SDA's today.
The real problem with that is that the SDA eschatology relies heavily on these 2300 years which simply do not exist in the Bible.

That verse says days and it can only mean days, regardless of how much any false teacher wants it to means years.......

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

...Dan 8:14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed. ...

Brother DaveW,

 

Would you mind if I ask you if you were ever a Seventh-day Adventist [please do not take offense if no, I am just curious]?

 

Would you be interested in considering a few questions about Daniel 8 ahead of topic?

 

I will keep my replies short as I am able if you will converse with me and enter into a few questions with me.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

No, but I have known some, and have done some study, including of SDA produced material.

I am utterly convinced that SDA are wrong on salvation, eternity, eschatology, and more, and your babblings do nothing to change that view.

Your logic and explanations are just what I see in the documents I have, and the errors of logic, of application, of referencing, and of explanation are obvious, even without resorting to the books I have which expose the errors and deceit of the SDA.

I am not interested in joining you in any sort of study, but I will happily continue to challenge your misuse and abuse of Scripture.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

No, but I have known some, and have done some study, including of SDA produced material.

I am utterly convinced that SDA are wrong on salvation, eternity, eschatology, and more, and your babblings do nothing to change that view.

Your logic and explanations are just what I see in the documents I have, and the errors of logic, of application, of referencing, and of explanation are obvious, even without resorting to the books I have which expose the errors and deceit of the SDA.

I am not interested in joining you in any sort of study, but I will happily continue to challenge your misuse and abuse of Scripture.

Ok, thank you for answering the questions as you have.  :)

 

Well, perhaps you can help me out then, and you can teach me.  :)

 

In the third year of the reign of king Belshazzar a vision appeared unto me, even unto me Daniel, after that which appeared unto me at the first. Daniel 8:1

 

And I saw in a vision; and it came to pass, when I saw, that I was at Shushan in the palace, which is in the province of Elam; and I saw in a vision, and I was by the river of Ulai. Daniel 8:2

 

What was the first beast that Daniel saw in the vision?

 

What was the second beast that Daniel saw in the vision?

 

What does the first beast represent in the vision?

 

What does the second beast represent in the vision?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Its not the USA.........

Excellent, I do not believe that either of those two beasts in Daniel 8, the 1st or the 2nd are the USA either!  Now that we know what it is not, can you tell me what they are, and what they represent, and how you came to that conclusion based upon the scripture?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

I've already told you that I have no interest in joining you in any sort of study, aside to that which would lead you to eternal life, but I will continue to expose your false teaching at every opportunity.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Daniel 8 records events past when the Medo-Persian Empire was overthrown by the Greek Empire under Alexander the Great.

When Alexander died, the Empire was divided in four parts.  The "little horn" was Antiochus IV Epiphanes who headed the Selucid

part of the Greek Empire.  There were constant battles between the Selucid ("Syria", includes Israel) and Ptolemic ("Egypt") parts.

Antiochus Epiphanes desecrated the holy place in the Temple in Jerusalem.  The Temple was redidicated on what we now

celebrate as Hanukkah (it is mentioned in John's Gospel as the Feast Day in Winter Jn10:22, the ONLY holy day that is in Winter).

 

The record in Daniel 8:1-22 is so precise that liberal biblical scholars insist that Daniel was written in the 2nd Century BC. 

Now, Daniel 8:23-26 very well could be a reference to the coming Antichrist who will also desecrate the Temple... "abomination of desolation".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Daniel 1

 

And the king spake unto Ashpenaz the master of his eunuchs, that he should bring [certain] of the children of Israel, and of the king's seed, and of the princes; Daniel 1:3

 

We see three groups chosen by the master of Nebuchadnezzar's eunuchs:

 

[1] the children [Heb: 'sons'] of Israel

[2] of the King's seed

[3] of the princes [Heb: 'nobles']

 

King Nebuchadnezzar would have the most intelligent and studious men/captives of Israel, from the various classes of life, from commoner to royalty, serve in His kingdom, so that his own power, wisdom and glory would increase among the nations, but God had other purposes for these things, in that God would make known His power, wisdom and glory through His special chosen even in the midst of the most exalted pagan nation on earth:

 

Seest thou a man diligent in his business? he shall stand before kings; he shall not stand before mean men. Proverbs 22:29

 

I will speak of thy testimonies also before kings, and will not be ashamed. Psalms 119:46

 

While circumstances may have looked hopeless to the captives, God's purposes are far and above that of man's, and His glory will be made known:

 

Behold, he taketh away, who can hinder him? who will say unto him, What doest thou? Job 9:12

 

For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. Isaiah 55:8

 

For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts. Isaiah 55:9

 

Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me, Isaiah 46:9

 

Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure: Isaiah 46:10

 

This taking of the people to serve in court of Babylon was in fulfillment of the very words of God in the prophecy of Isaiah:

 

And of thy sons that shall issue from thee, which thou shalt beget, shall they take away; and they shall be eunuchs in the palace of the king of Babylon. Isaiah 39:7

 

And of thy sons that shall issue from thee, which thou shalt beget, shall they take away; and they shall be eunuchs in the palace of the king of Babylon. 2 Kings 20:18

 

What God declares is to come to pass, He will bring it to pass:

 

For with God nothing shall be impossible. Luke 1:37

 

And he said, The things which are impossible with men are possible with God. Luke 18:27

 

...with God all things are possible.” Matthew 19:26

 

...for with God all things are possible.” Mark 10:27

 

“Is any thing too hard for the LORD? ...” Genesis 18:14

 

So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it. Isaiah 55:11

 

Ah Lord GOD! behold, thou hast made the heaven and the earth by thy great power and stretched out arm, and there is nothing too hard for thee: Jeremiah 32:17

 

Behold, I am the LORD, the God of all flesh: is there any thing too hard for me? Jeremiah 32:27

 

God, in His infinite Love, will allow and/or decree such circumstances to so come about that will reveal our deep need of Him in every aspect of our lives, that we may totally distrust self as any reliable guide. For we do not set morality or our own criteria for what is sacred and holy. Additionally, we cannot of our own selves do anything:

 

I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing. John 15:5

 

But through Christ Jesus, “all things”:

 

I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me. Philippians 4:13

 

And so we see the LORD God is dealing with His children, that they may know Him, in His infinite love for them, that He had not abandoned them, but was with them:

 

For we were bondmen; yet our God hath not forsaken us in our bondage, ...” Ezra 9:9

 

Nevertheless for thy great mercies' sake thou didst not utterly consume them, nor forsake them; for thou art a gracious and merciful God. Nehemiah 9:31

 

And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him: Hebrews 12:5

 

For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth. Hebrews 12:6

 

If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not? Hebrews 12:7

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Daniel 8 records events past when the Medo-Persian Empire was overthrown by the Greek Empire under Alexander the Great.

When Alexander died, the Empire was divided in four parts.  The "little horn" was Antiochus IV Epiphanes who headed the Selucid

part of the Greek Empire.  There were constant battles between the Selucid ("Syria", includes Israel) and Ptolemic ("Egypt") parts. ...

The part in blue is partially correct.  The part in red, though given sometimes, is unfortunately, entirely incorrect for very specific reasons as we shall see.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

I've already told you that I have no interest in joining you in any sort of study, aside to that which would lead you to eternal life, but I will continue to expose your false teaching at every opportunity.

I see.  Well, thank you for participating as you have thus far, and for being agreeable to speak a little with me.  In the future, if you do desire to contribute something of a positive and edifying nature, please do so.  :)  In the meantime, thank you for supporting this thread with your posts.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Banner, please, would you tell us what they are, and please back that with scripture. Thank you.

The [parts of the] vision [under immediate discussion] as seen by Daniel [in Daniel 8] - Daniel 8:1-2:

 

1st Beast of Daniel 8 - "...a ram which had two horns ..." Daniel 8:3

2nd Beast of Daniel 8 - "...he goat... the goat had a notable horn between his eyes." Daniel 8:5

 

The interpretation [of those parts under immediate discussion] as given by "Gabriel" - Daniel 8:16

 

The interpretation of the 1st Beast - "The ram which thou sawest having two horns are the kings of Media and Persia." Daniel 8:20

The interpretation of the 2nd Beast - "And the rough goat is the king of Grecia: and the great horn that is between his eyes is the first king." Daniel 8:21

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.



×
×
  • Create New...