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The Glory Land

Churches That Are Against Having Drums In The Music...

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Does it sound like what the world is playing?  Like CCM does?  If so, it's wrong.  Our music ought to as different to the world as our lives.  If heard on the readio, there should be no question even within the first few notes about what type of music it is, worldly/Godly.

My personal philosophy for myself is that if it makes me want to tap my foot or get up and dance around, it's worldly music.  The music is as important as lyrics.  Good lyrics with bad music is bad music.

Tap my foot? I tap my foot to Amazing Grace (waltz time) and When We All Get to Heaven (march time)

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My personal philosophy for myself is that if it makes me want to tap my foot or get up and dance around, it's worldly music.  The music is as important as lyrics.  Good lyrics with bad music is bad music.

If I applied that rule to myself I could allow no music or singing at all in my church.  I cannot listen to any type of music without automatically keeping time to it like tapping my toes or rocking my feet back and forth in time to the music.  It doesn't seem to matter if it is Amazing Grace or Bach or Beethoven.  Flaw in my character?  Could be, I guess.

 

God bless,

Larry

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I would agree, HC.  But, as I said, in every Church I have been in that had drums, the drummer always ended up getting rocky.  Never failed.

I believe you!  I've been in a few churches where they had drums and.... :freaked:   I can say unequivocally, however, that ours doesn't.  We do have drums - we have a full orchestra.  We have been criticized for some of our music (who hasn't), but our music is really quite superb.  

 

Montana - I would agree to a point that tapping of the foot could indicate that the music is secular - if tapping (physical reaction) is the first response.  I, too, at times find myself tapping my foot to music that is not at all worldly.  Kinda like kids who you see in the pews who are pretending to play along with the piano or direct the singing.  :thumb:

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many churches and pastors make the "no drum" rule because of the sensuous beat.  It not only prevails in rock music, but in the primitive tribes of long ago.  I guess it's a matter of separation of some, and acceptable to others.

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Does it sound like what the world is playing?  Like CCM does?  If so, it's wrong.  Our music ought to as different to the world as our lives.  If heard on the readio, there should be no question even within the first few notes about what type of music it is, worldly/Godly.

My personal philosophy for myself is that if it makes me want to tap my foot or get up and dance around, it's worldly music.  The music is as important as lyrics.  Good lyrics with bad music is bad music.

What is wrong with foot tapping?

 

According to Scripture there is nothing wrong with dancing either, if not performed in a sinful manner. Dancing was often a big part of Jewish worship.

 

Just because something flows through our emotions of "feelings" doesn't mean it's of the world. God gave us emotions and feelings, just as He gave us sexual passions, and none of them are wrong unless used in a sinful manner.

 

Even the tune to many hymns matches or is similar to some tunes of secular music and songs so that the hymn doesn't necessarily stand out as a Christian hymn until the words come forth.

 

There is little, if anything, that the world isn't or hasn't been involved with and used to one extent or another. We can't base our choices of music, or other things, simply upon whether the world has or does use or do something similar.

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I find no mention of drums in the New Testament Church in my Bible.  Are they in yours?

Only percussion instruments I find mentioned in the New Testament are 'tinkling cymbals."  "Tinkling" doesn't paint a picture of deafening music, imo.

I don't find church buses, restrooms, pews, pulpits, lights, heating and air conditioning, etc etc in the NT church in my bible either.

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I would agree, HC.  But, as I said, in every Church I have been in that had drums, the drummer always ended up getting rocky.  Never failed.

I been to a few where they didn't get "rocky". Or country for that matter since country music is just as bad as rock if you want to get down to it.

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The drums keeps the beat of the music, its timing starts and ends the song. It fills in the gaps with its cymbals. Also it cover mistakes when others are off beat.  :musicboohoo:

 

If the drums are covering others' mistakes, than IMO they are already way too loud!

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If the drums are covering others' mistakes, than IMO they are already way too loud!

Sometimes, but I also know some of the piano ladies do the same thing (helping to cover mistakes) with their piano and it's not through extra loud pianoing. :biggrin:

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Sometimes, but I also know some of the piano ladies do the same thing (helping to cover mistakes) with their piano and it's not through extra loud pianoing. :biggrin:

 

You can not tell the pastor son, that he cannot play in the group right. :knuppel:

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All percussion instruments "keep the beat" - including the piano, drums, hammered dulcimer, cymbals, triangle, wood block, xylaphone,  and so many more (even some reed instruments).  And if the players do their job right, they enhance rather than detract from the other instruments.

 

I grew up with all orchestral instruments in my life.  My violin instructor never met an instrument he couldn't play.  (He was a German Jew who escaped Hitler.) In all my years associated with orchestras, I've never heard one that emphasized the drums to the detriment of the rest of the instruments.  

 

Our church had a band rather than an orchestra when we first began attending.  But over the years, strings were added (which were the only component missing to make it a full orchestra).  Even then, drums were not the emphasis.

 

Ian - I have seen pictures of them - how do they sound?

 

TGL - any member who can play an instrument is welcome to play in our orchestra.  :icon_smile:

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What is wrong with foot tapping?

 

According to Scripture there is nothing wrong with dancing either, if not performed in a sinful manner. Dancing was often a big part of Jewish worship.

 

Just because something flows through our emotions of "feelings" doesn't mean it's of the world. God gave us emotions and feelings, just as He gave us sexual passions, and none of them are wrong unless used in a sinful manner.

 

Even the tune to many hymns matches or is similar to some tunes of secular music and songs so that the hymn doesn't necessarily stand out as a Christian hymn until the words come forth.

 

There is little, if anything, that the world isn't or hasn't been involved with and used to one extent or another. We can't base our choices of music, or other things, simply upon whether the world has or does use or do something similar.


Something to think about.  Thanks brother.

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All percussion instruments "keep the beat" - including the piano, drums, hammered dulcimer, cymbals, triangle, wood block, xylaphone,  and so many more (even some reed instruments).  And if the players do their job right, they enhance rather than detract from the other instruments.

...........

Ian - I have seen pictures of them - how do they sound?

 

It's a very subdued sound by western drum-kit standards.

 

We sang the first one "Jai, jai kaar" is the chorus on this youtube at our last fellowship meeting - I often take my Indian harmonium - I haven't got a tabla nor have I tried one - perhaps I will next time I get my hair cut - the Indian music shop where I bought my harmonium (& my mouth organ) is next door to the barber.

 

You can hear:

(Jai jai kaar, Jai jai kaar, toone mere leeye kiaa kuchh naa keeyaa (repeated))

 

Translation:

Lord your love is very great, yes your love is very great,

I was dead in all my sin & you gave new life to me,

So why should I not lift up my voice to you

I will praise, I will praise, I will praise my God who gives all things to me.

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All percussion instruments "keep the beat" - including the piano, drums, hammered dulcimer, cymbals, triangle, wood block, xylaphone,  and so many more (even some reed instruments).  And if the players do their job right, they enhance rather than detract from the other instruments.

 

I grew up with all orchestral instruments in my life.  My violin instructor never met an instrument he couldn't play.  (He was a German Jew who escaped Hitler.) In all my years associated with orchestras, I've never heard one that emphasized the drums to the detriment of the rest of the instruments.  

 

Our church had a band rather than an orchestra when we first began attending.  But over the years, strings were added (which were the only component missing to make it a full orchestra).  Even then, drums were not the emphasis.

 

Ian - I have seen pictures of them - how do they sound?

 

TGL - any member who can play an instrument is welcome to play in our orchestra.  :icon_smile:

 

 

Can I bring my Bongo's   :)

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This whole thing leads to what I see as a larger issue: Should music play such a large role in the church as it does?

 

I am not even talking just about the contemporary rock n roll churches but even the good IFB churches, where they have a huge orchestra and choir, and 5 or six songs are 'performed' as well as four or five hymns.

 

When I read anything in the Bible related specifically to the activities of/in the assembly, I see music virtualy absent. I see preach, teach, reprove, reuke, exhort, doctrine, prophecy, prayer. !&2 Timothy and 1Cor are great places to find direction for the church, as well as Acts, for examples of practices. Where is the music?

 

I see we are to speak to one another and ourselves and the Lord with psalms, hymns and spiritual songs-doesn't even say to sing. Two of these could be purely personal, and the other, either among the assembly, or not.

 

So, very little about music, and virtually nothing about music as a part of corporate worship and praise in the church. And yet, it seems to be a major function of the churches anymore, sometimes even to overshadowing the preaching and teaching, which are the absoute primary activity of the churches. Today, we have fifth-Sunday-sings, Christmas and Easter contatas of all music and maybe a little play with it. The church my wife and I attended on our honeymoon had about 40 minutes of music and 15 minutes of preaching and announcements. Very poor percentages.

 

So again, this is my question: Should we even have much music at all in the church? Where is its biblical, NT basis? Sure, lots in the OT Temple worship, but almost nothing in the NT.

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As for drums, the difference with them from other instruments is that they do't keep the beat, they drive the beat. They have been successfully used for particular nefarious purposes past and present.

 

During the sacrfices of babies to Molech, they would play drums very loudly to both drown out the screams of the burning infants, as well as to drive the people into a trance-state.

 

Voodoo practitioners use the drum to go into a trance to open themselves to possessions.

 

In Rock music, drums are used to both drive the beat, as wel as to set an hypnotic state on the listeners.

 

While its true that drums, themselves are not 'evil', their use has been for such wickedness in the past, it is difficult to ignore the associations, unless we are ignorant of them. Remember, the Lord demands that He be worshiped and aproached in holiness, not to be worshiped as the heathen worship their gods and more often than not, drums are heavily associated with pagan practices. Should we do the same?

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This whole thing leads to what I see as a larger issue: Should music play such a large role in the church as it does?

 

I am not even talking just about the contemporary rock n roll churches but even the good IFB churches, where they have a huge orchestra and choir, and 5 or six songs are 'performed' as well as four or five hymns.

 

When I read anything in the Bible related specifically to the activities of/in the assembly, I see music virtualy absent. I see preach, teach, reprove, reuke, exhort, doctrine, prophecy, prayer. !&2 Timothy and 1Cor are great places to find direction for the church, as well as Acts, for examples of practices. Where is the music?

 

I see we are to speak to one another and ourselves and the Lord with psalms, hymns and spiritual songs-doesn't even say to sing. Two of these could be purely personal, and the other, either among the assembly, or not.

 

So, very little about music, and virtually nothing about music as a part of corporate worship and praise in the church. And yet, it seems to be a major function of the churches anymore, sometimes even to overshadowing the preaching and teaching, which are the absoute primary activity of the churches. Today, we have fifth-Sunday-sings, Christmas and Easter contatas of all music and maybe a little play with it. The church my wife and I attended on our honeymoon had about 40 minutes of music and 15 minutes of preaching and announcements. Very poor percentages.

 

So again, this is my question: Should we even have much music at all in the church? Where is its biblical, NT basis? Sure, lots in the OT Temple worship, but almost nothing in the NT.

So because there's almost nothing in the NT, we don't sing?  We don't use instruments?  Psalms, where we are told to praise the Lord with instruments is moot simply because it's OT?  I don't think so.  There's an awful lot in "corporate worship" that is not in the Bible.  Yes, we can call it tradition of man, but it actually only becomes that if it is anti-Bible...and praising God with instrument and voice is not.   The music would be in the same place that Sunday School, Sunday morning, Sunday night, Wednesday night services are; the same place set visitation times are; and so forth.  If we only do that which is obviously outlined in scripture, we are all wrong, because we aren't meeting daily from house to house...

 

I totally agree that if the singing overshadows the preaching it's wrong.  But just because some churches do that doesn't mean all do.  God created us as musical beings (yes, I know - some can't sing...but they can enjoy the music) and He encourages us to praise Him with that music (again vocally and instrumentally) in the Psalms.  

 

As for drums, the difference with them from other instruments is that they do't keep the beat, they drive the beat. They have been successfully used for particular nefarious purposes past and present.  When played properly, they don't drive the beat any more than any other percussion instrument, like the piano.

 

During the sacrfices of babies to Molech, they would play drums very loudly to both drown out the screams of the burning infants, as well as to drive the people into a trance-state.

 

Voodoo practitioners use the drum to go into a trance to open themselves to possessions.

 

In Rock music, drums are used to both drive the beat, as wel as to set an hypnotic state on the listeners.

 

While its true that drums, themselves are not 'evil', their use has been for such wickedness in the past, it is difficult to ignore the associations, unless we are ignorant of them. Remember, the Lord demands that He be worshiped and aproached in holiness, not to be worshiped as the heathen worship their gods and more often than not, drums are heavily associated with pagan practices. Should we do the same?  

Guaranteed that those who use drums in an ungodly way would know the difference between their music and godly music.  

 

The heathen also sing, and yet we are told to praise the Lord with song.  They use other instruments.  And yet we are told to praise the Lord with instruments.  There are a lot of things that have been used for wickedness - that does not make them intrinsically wicked.  

 

Don't get me wrong, Uke. If you don't want to use certain instruments (or any) in your services, kudos to you!  Really and honestly.  But we have to be careful of questioning the holiness of others because they do.  Now, if they use them in a way that links them to heathenish music, yes there is a question of their holiness. But if they don't use it that way, then there oughtn't be question - especially from those who are fellow-Christians. KWIM?

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