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Promoting Strength


Donald

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The kind of “strength” that I am talking about is “Spiritual strength”....
“Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, [but] not to doubtful disputations.”
(Romans 14:1)


This passage in Romans talks about two different kinds of Christians: Those that are “weak in the faith”, and those that are strong in the faith.  And a big problem that a lot of pastors have had over the centuries, has been promoting weakness instead of strength. Now before I get into “how we can promote Spiritual strength”, lets look at how “Spiritual weakness” is promoted.

One way a pastor promotes weakness, is by “throwing blankets” on things.
For instance, preaching against having a TV in your home.  This is throwing a blanket over everything that can come out of a TV, as evil or wicked or ungodly.
This is just like throwing a blanket over sex, as evil or wicked and ungodly, when sex in marriage is a pure and beautiful thing.

Every time a preacher preaches against “TV” or “Rock and Roll” or “the internet” etc, he is promoting weakness in his congregation.  Because in reality, none of these things are evil or wicked or ungodly......
“Unto the pure all things [are] pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving [is] nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.” (Titus 1:15)

This has been done for hundreds of years and it always brings the same result.  One of my favorite preachers Charles Spurgeon, used to regularly preach against gong to the theater, but the “Downgrade” continued!
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Now for promoting strength, all a preacher has to do is “PREACH THE WORD”; And not what he has heard other preachers preach about.
You can’t find one single word in the Bible about TV or Secular music, yet a lot of good men preach against these things, because “it is expected out of every solid preacher”, to preach against these things.

If the man of God “Preaches the Word” alone, this will promote Spiritual strength, because it will “GROW” Christians in the faith.
 

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Every time a preacher preaches against “TV” or “Rock and Roll” or “the internet” etc, he is promoting weakness in his congregation.  Because in reality, none of these things are evil or wicked or ungodly......


You can’t find one single word in the Bible about TV or Secular music, 

 

Yes Rock-n-Roll is evil, wicked and ungodly.  The term itself promotes sin in more ways than one.

 

When referring to the hellavision and secular music, God gave us principals to follow which can be learned through his Word.  Many of those have to do with the doctrine of separation but the Good Lord also tells us the kinds of music that He wants us to make and sing for Him.  The opposite of which is ungodly and therefore sinful.

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Yes Rock-n-Roll is evil, wicked and ungodly.  The term itself promotes sin in more ways than one.

 

When referring to the hellavision and secular music, God gave us principals to follow which can be learned through his Word.  Many of those have to do with the doctrine of separation but the Good Lord also tells us the kinds of music that He wants us to make and sing for Him.  The opposite of which is ungodly and therefore sinful.

 

Hello swathdiver

As I have said before, the main reason I post here is to be corrected and convinced that I am wrong, so that I can repent: And although I truly believe what I wrote in this OP, I also welcome a convincing argument that will set me straight.

As for the argument that you have presented(with no Scripture).....
I have heard it before and the Holy Spirit doesn’t seem to convict me that it holds water.
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Yes, I do agree that principles taught in Scripture should guide our lives; Yet I have never seen such principles concerning secular music or entertainment, derived from Scripture.
 

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Yes, if those who hear it will use it instead of thinking its not meant for them but for another person who is setting in the pews.

 

Our only responsibility is PREACHING IT!  (And that is all!)

It’s when we start trying to ..... somehow make it work better, that we start adding to it!
(And encouraging people to trust in “what we have added”, instead of God’s Word!)
 

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Hello swathdiver

As I have said before, the main reason I post here is to be corrected and convinced that I am wrong, so that I can repent: And although I truly believe what I wrote in this OP, I also welcome a convincing argument that will set me straight.

As for the argument that you have presented(with no Scripture).....
I have heard it before and the Holy Spirit doesn’t seem to convict me that it holds water.
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Yes, I do agree that principles taught in Scripture should guide our lives; Yet I have never seen such principles concerning secular music or entertainment, derived from Scripture.
 

 

 

Do you know the verses that make up the doctrine of separation?  

 

On that basis alone we should separate from nearly all secular music and the hellavision.  

 

How does 1 Corinthians 14:40 "Let all things be done decently and in order" square with Elvis Presley pumping his hips and jumping around on stage to loud music?  Or 5,000 members of a "church" jumping up and down, writhing on the ground to rock music so loud that it hurts your brain?  Or watching a television show where the character mixes Scripture with Eastern Mysticism or scantily clad women or the promotion of alcohol and adultery?

 

As for Godly music, yes, that does take some study and in previous posts we've given the verses here but the principles are best learned by reading the books written by the composers and musicians who've shown us the verses from the Bible.  

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Our only responsibility is PREACHING IT!  (And that is all!)

It’s when we start trying to ..... somehow make it work better, that we start adding to it!
(And encouraging people to trust in “what we have added”, instead of God’s Word!)
 

 

I don't suppose you saw my if, my if was not placing any blame on the pastor, preacher.

 

A pastor, preacher, has much more responsibility than just preaching. No pastors responsibility ends at the end of the preaching. Although many pastors thinks their only responsibility is to preach, & after preaching they have nothing whatsoever to do until the next preaching service.

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I had intended not to use this thread to “defend” TV or secular music at all; but just to point out how blankets should not be thrown over them, as being completely wicked.

But.... it occurred to me, that an example might be helpful.

Note: Embedded video removed by moderator. Discussion is welcome, but rock music is not permitted on this forum.

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Now these have nothing to do with my “Spiritual life”, but they are pleasant to my ear.

And although they are both just “songs”, I pay close attention to every word of the lyrics or the message they send.  I do this with EVERYTHING in my life, from every sermon I listen to, to every movie I watch, to every song that I listen to.

At this point in my walk with the Lord, I see some of the simple pleasures of this life as being gifts, the Lord has given me to enjoy.
 

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This has nothing to do with your spiritual life? And to think, I thought Jesus was to be the saved person whole life, that is surrender to Him letting Him live though you.If your keeping Him out of part of your life, your not dead to self letting Him live though you.

 

Ga 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

 

I fall way of short of this as well.

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This has nothing to do with your spiritual life? And to think, I thought Jesus was to be the saved person whole life, that is surrender to Him letting Him live though you.If your keeping Him out of part of your life, your not dead to self letting Him live though you.

 

Ga 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

 

I fall way of short of this as well.

 

But then the Bible says, that God has given us this life to “enjoy”.....
Ecclesiastes 3:12-13
V.12 I know that [there is] no good in them, but for [a man] to rejoice,
and to do good in his life.
V.13 And also that every man should eat and drink, and enjoy the good
of all his labour, it [is] the gift of God.

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Like I have always said, I DO NOT HAVE ALL THE ANSWERS.

But at this point in my life with Christ, I understand that for some reason, God made our “human bodies” with certain physical and emotional needs; And when we (on our own), turn our back on these needs, it adversely effects our entire life; Including our Spiritual life.  (This is why Jesus needed to take a vacation from His ministry every so often.)

Now, I NEVER take a vacation from my faith; Just as even when Jesus was taking a needed rest, He was still following His Father’s instructions.....

That is enough for now.
 

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You're right Donald, these songs don't feed our spirit, just our flesh.  Please don't take this as us being harsh, just trying to help each other out.

 

There are thousands of fleshly songs that I used to listen to that fed the lust of my flesh.  Just because they are pleasing to our untrained (untrained in the music of God) ears, doesn't mean they are ok to listen to.

 

I liked the song Rocket Man by Elton John.  It played on the tv on the cruise ship all day long, after listening to it for most of my life I finally paid attention to the words, it was about a drug trip!  Many of these songs are memories from my childhood, Saturday mornings spent playing with my parents on the carpet while Dad played his records.  But they are evil and we should serve God and not Man.

 

It's not easy, I had a weak moment last night and played the Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald on youtube while I worked.

 

As for the songs posted there are several things wrong with them.  First applies to separation.  Second, the structure and sound of the music is far more important than the lyrics, they're used to control our moods and they do.  Is it Christ-honoring or does it feed the flesh with sorrow or sensualness for example?   Least important are the lyrics, but what message is the author trying to convey?  Does it honor God?

 

Debbie Boone's song, "You Light Up My Life" some have said could be a picture of Jesus Christ.  But one verse says, "It can't be wrong, if it feels so right".  That's contrary to the Bible.  We're to Trust God's Word, not ourselves!  Our hearts are deceitful and desperately wicked.

 

I feel like doing a lot of things but God's Word and the Ten Commandments written on my conscience keeps me in check, sort of.   :icon_rolleyes:

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We need to be careful to leave room for grace. Not everyone is at the same level of maturity, not in the natural or the spiritual. Not everyone is convicted of the same thing at the same time. There are some things one can do and another can't.

 

Whether music, TV or other forms of entertainment, just because it's not specifically Christian doesn't mean it can't feed ones spirit or that it feeds the flesh. If such were the case we would have to condemn most patriotic and children's songs and stories.

 

I've been in Christ for almost 32 years. I can look back over my life and see many changes during that time. There are forms of entertainment I would have enjoyed at one time that I don't know, and didn't then but do now. Anyone who has been in Christ for some years should be aware of this.

 

I know many good Christians who listen to music I don't, watch shows I don't, enjoy sports and other forms of entertainment I don't, read books I don't, vacation where I wouldn't, etc. One could look at me over the course of my life in Christ and say the same things.

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I know many good Christians who listen to music I don't, watch shows I don't, enjoy sports and other forms of entertainment I don't, read books I don't, vacation where I wouldn't, etc. One could look at me over the course of my life in Christ and say the same things.

 

Correct, but that doesn't make what they're doing right or in Liberty if it doesn't honor the Lord.

 

So to see a fellow church member at a Gaither concert or parking their car at the nude beach doesn't mean its ok because they've been members of the church and in good standing for 20 years.  Wrong is still wrong. 

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Correct, but that doesn't make what they're doing right or in Liberty if it doesn't honor the Lord.

 

So to see a fellow church member at a Gaither concert or parking their car at the nude beach doesn't mean its ok because they've been members of the church and in good standing for 20 years.  Wrong is still wrong. 

I never said that whatever one is doing is necessarily right, only that they may be at a different point of growth than we are and it's possible that's not an area the Lord is dealing with in their lives at the moment.

 

There is nothing wrong with pointing out biblical truth if we do so in kindness and love with the intent to help. The problem comes when we try to force someone to accept what's being said or to change, or we speak ill of them or question their salvation because of that one matter.

 

Just as with soul winning, we are to present the truth and then let the Holy Ghost do His work in the hearers hearts. Too often we try to do the Holy Ghost's job using our own "wisdom and power".

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