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Pastor Charged With Felony For Spanking Son


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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Its getting rough out there.

The thing that makes me the maddest isn't necessarily the social workers (that is their job) but the nosey neighbors and teachers that feel its their job to turn people in at the slightest provocation.

Mind your own business people! Unless you see black eyes or bruised up backs, its none of your concern!

They also failed to mention....was this one of his own teachers in his own school? If so, its possible she had something against this pastor and wanted to get back with him.

Unfair that you can just ruin somebody's life with a phone call.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

More and more aspects involving obeying the Word of God are being declared illegal or are being treated as such.

If one corrects their children biblically, they can be arrested, jailed, have their children taken away, or in our case, be forced to take "anger management classes" and be "monitored" by the child services social workers for a year.

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HOw is this any different than the persecution of Jews in Nazi Germany? All a neighbor had to do was report any slight wrong doing to the local authorities and the Jew would be roundde up in the middle of the night and sent off to a concentration camp never to be seen or heard from again. School teachers in Pubic Schools are the MOST anti-God and Anti-Christian liberals that ever walked the earth! I ought to know becuase I used to be a teacher - and once I was in the system I was very much pressured to become a member of the "Borg Collective" and because I would not go along with them, I was thoroughly ostracized.

It is only a matter of time before any of us can be hauled away and locked up for no good reason - forgetting to use your seatbelt, rightfully disciplining n unruly child, and so forth. John your situation with your child is becoming more and more common place and the situation is only going to get worse. It is a way for the state to turn children against their parents.

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I always find it SO ironic...when we go out to eat, we often get compliments on our "well behaved children". Ok so they aren't always well behaved LOL but at least in public they know to be respectful and at a restaurant they sit and eat.

Its so interesting that the same people who are in awe of well behaved kids would probably turn you in if they knew you actually punished your child for being bad!

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist
Barnett is a pastor at Lighthouse Family Ministries in Poynette, Wis. A father of nine children, he founded Guardian Christian Academy.


Was this implying the child went to their Christian Church school or did he actually attend public school as someone suggested? It is a sad thing that I've heard two stories in recent years about church families (from 2 different churches) having trouble with Soc. Services.....both were from fellow church members "turning them in", both lost their kids at least temporarily, and both was just over the spanking issue. Scary.......
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I always find it SO ironic...when we go out to eat, we often get compliments on our "well behaved children". Ok so they aren't always well behaved LOL but at least in public they know to be respectful and at a restaurant they sit and eat.

Its so interesting that the same people who are in awe of well behaved kids would probably turn you in if they knew you actually punished your child for being bad!


This reminds me of what the lead child investigator told me. He said that he didn't believe I was an immediate threat to my oldest son (what's that really mean, he thinks I might have a plan to beat him on 11-11-2011 or something :roll ), and he then stated I'm obviously not a bad parent because our children are polite, well adjusted and have never been known to be a problem by anyone who has encountered them. (yet he still says he believes our oldest sons false charges, placed us under one year supervision and said I had to take anger management classes even though no one has ever even insinuated I have an anger problem :bonk: )

Well, I wonder if any of that could be said if I coddled them the way these social workers seem to think I should?

Of course, when spoiled children go out and get into trouble, they come and blame the parents for not controlling their children! :uuhm:
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Its going just like the Bible said it would.

16 Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.
1 Peter 4:16 (KJV)

The trouble is we've had it so easy, we're spoiled, now that some of are starting to sufferer from doing right it scares us to death and we can't stand it.

Just think how much suffering Peter, Paul and some of the others endured.

But that said, if it gets even worse, which I believe it will, what will we do, will we march forward doing what is right in the sight of God knowing we will suffer for it, or will we stop doing things God's way to keep from suffering for God's sake?

29 Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.
Acts 5:29 (KJV)

We know what choice Peter made, we know what the right choice is.

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Its going just like the Bible said it would.

16 Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.
1 Peter 4:16 (KJV)

The trouble is we've had it so easy, we're spoiled, now that some of are starting to sufferer from doing right it scares us to death and we can't stand it.

Just think how much suffering Peter, Paul and some of the others endured.

But that said, if it gets even worse, which I believe it will, what will we do, will we march forward doing what is right in the sight of God knowing we will suffer for it, or will we stop doing things God's way to keep from suffering for God's sake?

29 Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.
Acts 5:29 (KJV)

We know what choice Peter made, we know what the right choice is.


:goodpost:

There are many within the church today who, out of fear, won't spank their children, won't speak openly about certain politically incorrect subjects (homosexuality IS a sin; women are NOT to be preachers; abortion IS murder; etc.).

True, full fledged persecution has not yet begun and already Christians are running and hiding in fear.

Also, as I've posted previously, I've noticed a large increase in children from Christian families going bad and often bringing harm and evil upon their families. Scripture warns of this as well, telling us that in later times children will be disobedient to parents and that children will turn against their parents.
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:goodpost:

There are many within the church today who, out of fear, won't spank their children, won't speak openly about certain politically incorrect subjects (homosexuality IS a sin; women are NOT to be preachers; abortion IS murder; etc.).

True, full fledged persecution has not yet begun and already Christians are running and hiding in fear.

Also, as I've posted previously, I've noticed a large increase in children from Christian families going bad and often bringing harm and evil upon their families. Scripture warns of this as well, telling us that in later times children will be disobedient to parents and that children will turn against their parents.


True John, will may parents go along with the world, perhaps thinking I've got to do what is best for my children, its best for my children for me to mind the world instead of God.

That is if I mind the world them I want have to worry about losing my children.

I might add, certain children will use all the ropes to get their way with no regard what so ever for their parents.

For their are many children as well as parents who lack that natural affection for one another.
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  • Lady Administrators

Poor fellow. Our country is so upside down now. Good is evil and evil is good. Being a teacher is hard enough without putting on them the responsibility of turning in suspected abuse. Did you know that if the teacher were found out to have known about this but didn't report it, she would be charged? "Professionals" like teachers, doctors, etc., who know about supposed abuse (or even suspect it) are required to report it.

Don't get me wrong - as a teacher I never did, nor would I ever, report something like that. Number one, it isn't abuse. Number two, it isn't my business. Now, if the kid came to school with constant bruises or broken bones, I might inquire...but not just for a spanking...and not for bruises on the bottom, either. That happens, and they heal.

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If the teacher did not hear or see anything other than "My brother got spanked" then it is NOT suspected abuse, nor required to be turned in for that.

The law is not specific...it only says if you suspect abuse. Anyone who suspects abuse from well dressed, well behaved kids (especially PKs) who mention a spanking have too much time on their hands.

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If the teacher did not hear or see anything other than "My brother got spanked" then it is NOT suspected abuse, nor required to be turned in for that.

The law is not specific...it only says if you suspect abuse. Anyone who suspects abuse from well dressed, well behaved kids (especially PKs) who mention a spanking have too much time on their hands.


Actually, though, it is. If it went to court and it was found out that the teacher had been informed (even though it might be considered hearsay) she could get in trouble.

I think it's more than too much time on their hands...I think it's proof that our teachers have been socilized!! (as in - trained to be good socialists!)
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Actually, though, it is. If it went to court and it was found out that the teacher had been informed (even though it might be considered hearsay) she could get in trouble.

I think it's more than too much time on their hands...I think it's proof that our teachers have been socilized!! (as in - trained to be good socialists!)


I see what you are saying....but to me, as a former teacher...the odds are so much worse that my call will ruin a family, as compared to the odds that it will actually go to court and my name would be brought up.

I mean yeah, if I see bruises, yeah I'll say something. But if not...I would just say "Hey the kid had no bruises, he was socially normal, his parents were nice, I had no reason to believe the brother's side comment was anything serious."
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I agree with you - unless there were significant signs of damage, I wouldn't say anything...and even then, I certainly wouldn't go to authorities. I'd go to someone in the church first (not another member, to gossip, but probably a deacon, if the father, as in this case, was the pastor).

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Too many rights for the kiddos is what it boils down to.

Sociologists just sit around thinking of new ideas that hinder the moral character of our youth. Many of them aren't married or they are living in "alternative" life styles. I have seen it.

As a former school teacher...parents were afraid to discipline their children for fear of social workers and school psychologists. Put the school psychologist in a classroom with 30 children, and they didn't know what "classroom management" was. It was hilarious, in fact. They are licensed to teach but can't discipline at all. Instead, they try to reason and speak philosophical "mumbo jumbo" to our youth. The children ended up making their own rules (or lack of.) Another example of a society gone haywire.

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I don't know the details here' date=' but if he spanked hard enough to bruise, then they did the right thing.[/quote']
Not quite. Bruising is not always caused by being too hard. Many people bruise very easily - I am one. My husband just taps me sometimes and I bruise. And it was said that there were slight bruises, but the pics showed only redness. Not enough to be charged with a felony.
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I don't know the details here' date=' but if he spanked hard enough to bruise, then they did the right thing.[/quote']


More kids get bruises from their parents letting them play youth football or soccer, than from being correctly punished. As a matter of fact, tons of kids get bruises from the bikes their parents buy them....
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I don't know the details here' date=' but if he spanked hard enough to bruise, then they did the right thing.[/quote']

it's depends. Personally, I would not leave a bruise on my son if I was going to spank him. But if I had to compare which is better....

spanking or severe bruises and broken bones from across a street without looking because he disobey, I think I would rather for him to experience pain from spanking (I am NOT talking about bruising him ) than from being hit by a car because he disobey me when I told him no. I want him to relate pain to danger. you know, put 2 and 2 together.


Why do you think kids stop touching hot stoves? because they have experienced the pain from touching it. So spanking can be a healthy. I mean, I don't know a single child who learned their lesson not to touch hot stuffs without ever experiencing a single burn. (in fact, some parents teach their kids the one finger touch )

but I don't want them dead from learning everything themselves either.
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I agree...I'm not for bruising my kid at ALL....I hate that....don't like it one bit.

However if a child is stubborn and keeps refusing to obey....and keeps earning punishment...there comes a point where somebody is going to win. To let your child win means you have lost the battle for a LONG time. Bruising should not be normal or common or happen very much. But if it happens on occasion....because of a very stubborn child....a strong will....how can that be abuse?

Here is what I heard in the store that was abusive. A mom telling a child it was time to go home, "Please stop playing with the toys, please come home." Little girl kicks and cries saying "No! No! No!" Mom picks up kicking screaming child and says "Stop it now, stop it...you are gonna get yelled at....stop it."

"No! No! No!"

What happens when this child says NO to a policeman someday? "Mom never did more than yell at me...you mean now I have to get a ticket???" Kids must learn consequences to sin.

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I don't know the details here' date=' but if he spanked hard enough to bruise, then they did the right thing.[/quote']

Don't overlook the doctor's statement that there was NO swelling and that this WAS NOT abuse.
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To clarrify my post, I have nothing against spaking, though I will use it as a very last resort with my child. I do think if there are other ways to effectively discipline, those methods should be used first, but spaking as a last resort.

It should be up to the parent about how to discipline their child.

However, no parent should ever hit a child hard enough to leave a bruise. If I saw a childed that had bruses that looked like they were caused from hitting or spaking, I would call the authorities immediately.

Just saying someone spanked their child is not enough. So what is? Well, if I saw a child walking slowly, sitting slowly, acting like he was sore when he sat down, etc. I would certainly ask the child what the problem was. If he said his parents spanked him, I'd ask when and if it still hurt. If it still hurt, and I'd ask him if there were bruises there.

If a parent leaves a bruise, that is not right. I've seen some horrible photos of children who had black and blue behinds from "spanking." That is abuse, I don't care how to phrase it.

Like I said, I don't know all the facts about this situation, but if there were bruises, then an investigation is appropriate.

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I want to say too, that some children bruise easier than others. If you are talking a very small bruise, I think that's different than what you are describing, their whole butt being black and blue. And it certainly should never be on the back. God made the behind to be full of nice padding so nothing is injured.

I am totally saying that a bruise should NOT be common, if ever...but there are times, with a stubborn child, they may get a very small bruise, every once in awhile, especially if fair skinned.

That is not abuse.

Constant bruising, or large bruises, would yes, be abuse.

You have to remember too that parents who discipline their children in love with a spanking are much less abusive than a parent who never touches their child, yet screams and yells and cusses at them day in and day out. Why can't we through those kinds of parents in jail? Kids are suicidal all the time...possibly from severe emotional abuse? That's worse than any occasional rear end bruise.
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15 The rod and reproof give wisdom: but a child left to himself bringeth his mother to

Prov 29:15 (KJV)

3 A whip for the horse, a bridle for the ass, and a rod for the fool's back.

Prov 26:3 (KJV)

14 Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell.

Prov 23:14 (KJV)

13 Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die.

Prov 23:13 (KJV)

15 Foolishness is bound in the heart of a child; but the rod of correction shall drive it far from him.

Prov 22:15 (KJV)

24 He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes.

Prov 13:24 (KJV)

13 In the lips of him that hath understanding wisdom is found: but a rod is for the back of him that is void of understanding.

Prov 10:13 (KJV)

God is pretty clear on it. Like its been said, some children are very strong willed and to stop them from doing wrong, that which is harmful, it take more than a pat, some time its take enough to bruise their behind. If you let the child win, them that child is more than likely lost.

And no, a bruise being present does not mean an investigation is needed. Some people have never dealt with a very strong willed child that believe this, if they have, they lost.

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15 The rod and reproof give wisdom: but a child left to himself bringeth his mother to

Prov 29:15 (KJV)

3 A whip for the horse, a bridle for the ass, and a rod for the fool's back.

Prov 26:3 (KJV)

14 Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell.

Prov 23:14 (KJV)

13 Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die.

Prov 23:13 (KJV)

15 Foolishness is bound in the heart of a child; but the rod of correction shall drive it far from him.

Prov 22:15 (KJV)

24 He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes.

Prov 13:24 (KJV)

13 In the lips of him that hath understanding wisdom is found: but a rod is for the back of him that is void of understanding.

Prov 10:13 (KJV)

God is pretty clear on it. Like its been said, some children are very strong willed and to stop them from doing wrong, that which is harmful, it take more than a pat, some time its take enough to bruise their behind. If you let the child win, them that child is more than likely lost.

And no, a bruise being present does not mean an investigation is needed. Some people have never dealt with a very strong willed child that believe this, if they have, they lost.



:goodpost: I was just fixin' to put some Scripture up for this and I'm thankful you did the work for me :Green

Too many people don't take the Word of God seriously.
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Right on, I'm not saying parents ought to burse their children when whipping them, but sometimes it does happen. Its better to burse them than lose them because parents will not correct their children.

There is a woman who works with my wife, she has no control over her teenage daughter, the reason being, never corrected.

Some people think the young child who is wild an uncorrected is cute, but when they get a little older they're not so cute. I've seen several who were not so cute.

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You have to remember too that parents who discipline their children in love with a spanking are much less abusive than a parent who never touches their child' date=' yet screams and yells and cusses at them day in and day out. Why can't we through those kinds of parents in jail? Kids are suicidal all the time...possibly from severe emotional abuse? That's worse than any occasional rear end bruise.[/quote']

I completely agree. I was just saying I don't know all of the facts about this case, so cannot come to a conclusion. I expect that there was some very significant bruising or this guy would not have faced felony charges. IF that is not the case, this prosecutor needs to be thrown out of office.
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You have to remember too that parents who discipline their children in love with a spanking are much less abusive than a parent who never touches their child' date=' yet screams and yells and cusses at them day in and day out. Why can't we through those kinds of parents in jail? Kids are suicidal all the time...possibly from severe emotional abuse? That's worse than any occasional rear end bruise.[/quote']

I completely agree. I was just saying I don't know all of the facts about this case, so cannot come to a conclusion. I expect that there was some very significant bruising or this guy would not have faced felony charges. If that is not the case, this prosecutor needs to be thrown out of office.

I still stand by my position that bruising should NEVER be acceptable. I'm not saying that a small bruise once warrants an investigation, but if it happens once, that should clue a parent in that they are spanking too hard. If a child does not respond to a spanking that hard, perhaps that parent needs to find another form of discipline that is more effective.

As far as the argument goes that a child is better off by beating him so hard he bruises if he is strong willed makes no sense. Would he be better off if locked in a closet for three days? If a spanking so hard he bruises does not work, what about a whip? Come on now. That is taking it too far. If a child is that strong willed and does not respond to a spanking hard enough to leave a bruise, then perhaps the parent needs to find another form of discipline that is more effective for that child.
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