Jump to content
  • Welcome to Online Baptist

    Free to join.

RSS Robot

Way Of Life - Good Churches Ruined By Bad Associations

Recommended Posts

After studying the emerging church for the past five years, including attending one of the largest emerging church conferences with media credentials, reading several dozen of their books, and interviewing some prominent emerging leaders--and at the same time observing what is happening among fundamental Baptists--last year I issued a warning that most independent Baptist churches will be well down the contemporary/emerging path within a generation. 

wmibcwbi080412
I am more convinced of this with each passing month. 
Why Most Independent Baptist Churches Will Be Emerging within 20 Years” is a free eBook available at the Way of Life web site.

In this book I list the following eight reasons for my prediction:

The rejecting of warning and reproof in regard to certain heroes
Unquestioning loyalty to man
Following the crowd
Ignorance about important Issues
Soft separatism
Lack of serious discipleship
Carelessness about music
Quick Prayerism

More recently I have realized that a church doesn’t have to be guilty of all of these things to be a candidate for becoming emerging. All it has to do is be guilty of two of these: SOFT SEPARATISM, because soft separatism builds bridges to the wrong churches and the wrong preachers that act as conduits for the other areas of compromise to enter the congregation, and the REJECTION OF WARNING AND REPROOF in regard to certain IFB heroes, which makes it impossible to fully and properly educate the church about and separate the church from the compromise that spreading so quickly among IFBaptists. (A pastor that is unwilling to listen to warnings and reproof about certain heroes and unwilling to let his congregation entertain such warnings is guilty of giving unquestioning loyalty to man, so these things are intimately associated.) 




View the full article

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This stood out to me.



It is human nature to follow the crowd. We do this as children. We do it as teens. We do it as adults. We even do it as preachers. A major motive in this phenomenon is the fear of man, which is so often and staunchly condemned in Scripture.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After studying the emerging church for the past five years, including attending one of the largest emerging church conferences with media credentials, reading several dozen of their books, and interviewing some prominent emerging leaders--and at the same time observing what is happening among fundamental Baptists--last year I issued a warning that most independent Baptist churches will be well down the contemporary/emerging path within a generation.

wmibcwbi080412.jpg
I am more convinced of this with each passing month.
Why Most Independent Baptist Churches Will Be Emerging within 20 Years” is a free eBook available at the Way of Life web site.

In this book I list the following eight reasons for my prediction:

The rejecting of warning and reproof in regard to certain heroes
Unquestioning loyalty to man
Following the crowd
Ignorance about important Issues
Soft separatism
Lack of serious discipleship
Carelessness about music
Quick Prayerism

More recently I have realized that a church doesn’t have to be guilty of all of these things to be a candidate for becoming emerging. All it has to do is be guilty of two of these: SOFT SEPARATISM, because soft separatism builds bridges to the wrong churches and the wrong preachers that act as conduits for the other areas of compromise to enter the congregation, and the REJECTION OF WARNING AND REPROOF in regard to certain IFB heroes, which makes it impossible to fully and properly educate the church about and separate the church from the compromise that spreading so quickly among IFBaptists. (A pastor that is unwilling to listen to warnings and reproof about certain heroes and unwilling to let his congregation entertain such warnings is guilty of giving unquestioning loyalty to man, so these things are intimately associated.)




View the full article


Though I'm not sure I agree with everything you said, I do agree that the IFB certainly has a serious problem with honouring men ("heroes") and severe loyalty issues. Having just come out of an IFB church with these exact problems, I can see why, and how, cultism happens. I am left to pick up the pieces and feel as though I have been led astray ... what a horrible feeling. I feel such a burden for people who have felt they should follow the "man" over the Lord. Because of my nature :coverlaugh: , I tend to be quite blunt (not necessarily a good thing), so I ask them, "Did Pastor xxxx die for you?" No. Then "what is that to thee, follow thou me" (John 21:22). When we start lifting these men (so-called "heroes") up, we are actually setting them up for a fall. Jack Schaap being an excellent example. It saddens me greatly. The church that the Lord had originally designed has been falling apart for years and we know that as the Day draws near, it will be the 2-3's that will be left to worship Him as we ought. Sad times. Heartbreaking. And if it breaks my heart, how much more His? Christians, beware ...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If your pastor is faithful to the Bible and stands firmly against compromise I recommend you thank him on a regular basis. It can be a blessing for a pastor to hear that someone was spiritually fed by his message and stands by him. We also need to keep our personal church in prayer so that it doesn't succumb to the world as many other formerly sound churches have.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good article. I found it very enlightening and helpful. I couldn't help but be reminded of 2 Timothy 3:16-17 "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works."

We must never forget to try all things with Scripture, and if it's found wanting, reject it. Scripture gives us our doctrine. It reprooves us whenever we go astray. It shows us the correct way to approach something, and finally gives us instructions on how to achieve it. Man I love the Bible!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"We must never forget to try all things with Scripture, and if it's found wanting, reject it. Scripture gives us our doctrine. It reprooves us whenever we go astray. It shows us the correct way to approach something, and finally gives us instructions on how to achieve it. Man I love the Bible!"


Good advice Fixation, but isn't that kindergarten stuff? Nonetheless, we do have to back up and "get back to basics" occasionally.

I see it as a different sort of problem, not merely measuring a ministry and a man by the Bible, but measuring our own interpretation of said Bible. Too often we see what it says, but think that is not what it means; we often concentrate overmuch on the context, and miss the content of it.

For example, marriage: is it always wrong to divorce? That alone raises many opinions, and we all seek to back it with scripture, but what does it really say?

What about open trashing of one another? Don't we justify our thoughts by "scripture"? Of course we do, but we have to interpret it differently.

There are many issues we could name with a myriad of opposing opinions, and all claim scripture to justify them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"We must never forget to try all things with Scripture, and if it's found wanting, reject it. Scripture gives us our doctrine. It reprooves us whenever we go astray. It shows us the correct way to approach something, and finally gives us instructions on how to achieve it. Man I love the Bible!"


Good advice Fixation, but isn't that kindergarten stuff? Nonetheless, we do have to back up and "get back to basics" occasionally.

I see it as a different sort of problem, not merely measuring a ministry and a man by the Bible, but measuring our own interpretation of said Bible. Too often we see what it says, but think that is not what it means; we often concentrate overmuch on the context, and miss the content of it.

For example, marriage: is it always wrong to divorce? That alone raises many opinions, and we all seek to back it with scripture, but what does it really say?

What about open trashing of one another? Don't we justify our thoughts by "scripture"? Of course we do, but we have to interpret it differently.

There are many issues we could name with a myriad of opposing opinions, and all claim scripture to justify them.

That's the problem, too much opinion.

As with your example of divorce, there is far too much opinion and too little Scripture actually considered. We know God hates divorce and God's plan for marriage is "no divorce". If a husband and wife are Christians then they should be seeking to follow Christ in all things. Part of that is putting others, including your spouse, above yourself. We are called to surrender ourselves to the will of God. No husband and wife seeking to follow Christ will divorce, they will submit to one another, they will submit to Christ, they will work through their problems and make their marriage work in Christ.

That's a brief biblical model but for most professing Christians considering or getting a divorce there is little attention paid to Scripture. For them it's typically very self-centered with proclamations of "God wants me to be happy", "God has brought another person into my life and wants me to be with them", then there is often a long list of "I's" such as "I'm not submitting to them...I'm not putting my life on hold for them...I'm not working hard so they can do this/that...I'm not doing the housework 'cause I'm not a maid...I want to hang out with my friends just like when I was single...I don't want to deal with the children...

As is often the case we find ourselves putting our will ahead and above God's. We want things our way, including our Christianity. We don't want to submit to anyone, not even God. The idea of Jesus actually being Lord of our lives is something we are prone to rebel against. As long as we allow self and our emotions to rule over us we will be out of the will of God and putting our opinions above the eternal Word of God.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's the problem, too much opinion.

As with your example of divorce, there is far too much opinion and too little Scripture actually considered. We know God hates divorce and God's plan for marriage is "no divorce". If a husband and wife are Christians then they should be seeking to follow Christ in all things. Part of that is putting others, including your spouse, above yourself. We are called to surrender ourselves to the will of God. No husband and wife seeking to follow Christ will divorce, they will submit to one another, they will submit to Christ, they will work through their problems and make their marriage work in Christ.

That's a brief biblical model but for most professing Christians considering or getting a divorce there is little attention paid to Scripture. For them it's typically very self-centered with proclamations of "God wants me to be happy", "God has brought another person into my life and wants me to be with them", then there is often a long list of "I's" such as "I'm not submitting to them...I'm not putting my life on hold for them...I'm not working hard so they can do this/that...I'm not doing the housework 'cause I'm not a maid...I want to hang out with my friends just like when I was single...I don't want to deal with the children...

As is often the case we find ourselves putting our will ahead and above God's. We want things our way, including our Christianity. We don't want to submit to anyone, not even God. The idea of Jesus actually being Lord of our lives is something we are prone to rebel against. As long as we allow self and our emotions to rule over us we will be out of the will of God and putting our opinions above the eternal Word of God.


I get what you're saying here, John, but I just wanted to expand just a little bit on the bold/underlined part. The Bible tells wives that they are to submit to their husbands, not the other way around or even mutual submission. Husbands are told to love their wives as Christ loved the church. With that example, yes, a husband will love his wife unconditionally and never even consider divorce. He will handle his relationship with her using a servant heart. I'm pretty sure that's what you meant, based off of the rest of your post, but again, I thought it might be best to clarify that point.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I get what you're saying here, John, but I just wanted to expand just a little bit on the bold/underlined part. The Bible tells wives that they are to submit to their husbands, not the other way around or even mutual submission. Husbands are told to love their wives as Christ loved the church. With that example, yes, a husband will love his wife unconditionally and never even consider divorce. He will handle his relationship with her using a servant heart. I'm pretty sure that's what you meant, based off of the rest of your post, but again, I thought it might be best to clarify that point.



Ephesians 5:21

King James Version (KJV)

21 Submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God.

This is a part of esteeming one another better than ourselves. In marriage this would be a matter of submitting to caring for our spouse above ourselves. For husbands, this is part of loving our wives as Christ loved the church.

There are different aspects of submitting for a husband and wife, but both are called to a measure of submission.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would agree with what you said, John. I just want to point out that many times (especially nowadays) - and I know you know this, I'm just adding thought - one spouse is not interested in doing what Christ would have them do. And there is such rampant infidelity, even amongst preachers. It's a sad, sad thing...And I truly think that we need to get back to that kindergarten level you mentioned, irishman, to re-learn basic truths of the Bible.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The basics, our foundation, our first love, all these are so very important. It can be easy to forget one or more o them, it can be easy to get caught up in thinking we have moved beyond need to think of them, it's always easier to fall away than to stand firm.

Each year I make it a point to read at least one solid Christian book dealing with the foundational truths of the faith. One that I like is by Adrian Rogers, What Every Christian Ought To Know. There are others too, but that's the first that came to mind. I find each year as I read a foundational book that I'm reminded of something or the Holy Ghost helps me see something a bit differntly.

Also each year I make it a point to read at least one solid Christian book on marriage and/or Christian husbands. It's always beneficial to keep these things fresh in our minds and to see what the Holy Ghost might highlight each year.

If we don't guard our hearts and put effort into being firmly rooted and grounded in the Word, we can be sure the world, the flesh and devil will be rooting into our lives.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Who's Online   0 Members, 0 Anonymous, 37 Guests (See full list)

    There are no registered users currently online

Article Categories

About Us

Since 2001, Online Baptist has been an Independent Baptist website, and we exclusively use the King James Version of the Bible. We pride ourselves on a community that uplifts the Lord.

Contact Us

You can contact us using the following link. Contact Us or for questions regarding this website please contact @pastormatt or email James Foley at jfoley@sisqtel.net

Android App

Online Baptist has a custom App for all android users. You can download it from the Google Play store or click the following icon.

×
×
  • Create New...