Members JerryNumbers Posted June 23, 2012 Members Share Posted June 23, 2012 While I was in the Air Force my home church got a new pastor. He was only there a short time, & he was sent on his way shortly, for he was not what he claimed to be. Accusing this church of teaching church of Christ doctrine, which it did not. I'm sure he slandered this church to anyone that would listen. Personally I felt sorry for the man, trying to be a Baptist pastor yet could not tell the difference between Baptist & church of Christ teachings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators HappyChristian Posted June 25, 2012 Administrators Share Posted June 25, 2012 Though I have many of David Clouds sermons I have never listened to one nor read anything of his or read much about him. So my coming statement is not directed to him. But I have found through personal experience that those that demand separatism are usually the least separated, especially when they make a point of exposing those that "disagree" or share a slightly differing view point. When someone is on a band wagon it's usually best to get off and ride your own horse. Just so you know, David Cloud is definitely not one of the least separated. He does not expect of anyone what he doesn't practice himself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OFIB Preacher Posted June 26, 2012 Members Share Posted June 26, 2012 Fundamental Baptist Fellowship and Fundamental Baptist Fellowship International. Unless an explanation of both these names and their groups is later in this thread, I just may have to Google them. So far, this is the only answer I've gotten to my serious question. Looks like folk don't know how to answer questions, only debate or rather, ahem, discuss. Seriously, thanks for telling me what the letters mean! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OFIB Preacher Posted June 26, 2012 Members Share Posted June 26, 2012 You know I think we probably agree 98% of the time but I just don't see that. That kind of thinking is one of the things that eventually can lead to pastors going astray. If they are only exposed to people that either say they are wonderful or horrible it can become a temptation to believe the people who say they are wonderful and ignore all criticism. I have seen pastors like that and I am sure you have too. If someone says they consider so and so to still be a good pastor but think they have a fault in a given area what is the great harm in that? We say and believe pastors are just men and fallible so what is the problem with publicly naming names and saying you think so and so is wrong in a given area? You may or may not agree on a particular issue but why is it necessary to sweep all disagreements under the rug and publicly pretend that there is no disagreement until things get so bad they explode? This is not referring to this situation in particular as I do not and never have read the "sword of the Lord" nor do I really know that "crowd" and thus have no opinion one way or another. More of a general observation. I totally agree with this post. Sweeping things under the rug is no way to live. If someone is wrong in a certain area, folk should know it. I'm not saying focus on it all the time, but folk do need to be warned/admonished that who they may listen to is off in an area or two, yes, even among Independent Baptists. As previously stated, I used to be in Easy Believism/Quick Prayerism. The LORD used His word, preached by some of His choice men, to get me out of that false doctrine/way of life, pardon the pun here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OFIB Preacher Posted June 26, 2012 Members Share Posted June 26, 2012 To prove he stepped out of bounds would be to prove he was lying about this subject. Excuse me, edited to add, or that he was wrong in the accusation made. AMEN Brother Jerry! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OFIB Preacher Posted June 26, 2012 Members Share Posted June 26, 2012 It may not concern you but it concerns us if our church is one of the offenders or is in partnership with one of the offending churches. We need to be very careful who we yoke with. I have seen many churches creep to the liberal side because of who they decided to start yoking with. I'm in the AMEN corner on some of these today! You're exactly right! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OFIB Preacher Posted June 26, 2012 Members Share Posted June 26, 2012 I would have to think about it. Sword Of The Lord does teach a wrong view of repentance and that is a serious matter. Also, if any of the speakers has CCM in their church we need to separate from them. Discernment is really lacking in many IFB churches and Cloud is a big help to educate IFB leaders. I am not say I always agree with Cloud but he fills a role that I don't see anyone else helping with. Brother, right on target again! The SOTL is a hotbed of Easy Believism/Quick Prayerism. Another thing is, the SOTL claims to be an IFB publication, but they don't have an IFB as their editor. For that matter, are they even out of a local IFB church? I think they claim FRBC Murfreesboro somewhere/how, but just like a lot of "preachers" I've seen, just in name only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OFIB Preacher Posted June 26, 2012 Members Share Posted June 26, 2012 It concerns me very much where a pastor has preached, or held the position of pastor, if he was to happen to preach in our church. In a previous post I stated a preacher that I knew quite well years ago had held the position of pastor in some very questionable churches, not knowing this I would have him, yet knowing it I would not allow him behind my pulpit. I believe we are in an age, that many people firmly believes that you never to say one thing about a person unless its good. And If you can't say good about a person keep your mouth shut. Of course that comes from the liberals, for they want no one to warn anyone about them. And of course, a person is not going to agree with anyone 100% of the time, Unfortunately, folk still take what Grandma said, over what God says. Grandma has been quoted as saying "if ya cain't say anythin' good 'bout 'em, don't say nothin' at all!" Only thing is, God says among other things, to reprove, rebuke, exhort, with all longsuffering and doctrine. If someone's wrong in an area, folk need to be told and also to avoid said offender! No Nicolaitans 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OFIB Preacher Posted June 26, 2012 Members Share Posted June 26, 2012 So, if David Cloud is gossiping because of mentioning names, what's going on this thread? Just sayin... (please know that I'm not saying this shouldn't be discussed; but what's been said about David Cloud in this thread is of the same nature of the things he has said and been dissed as gossiping for) AMEN Sis! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 Unless an explanation of both these names and their groups is later in this thread, I just may have to Google them. So far, this is the only answer I've gotten to my serious question. Looks like folk don't know how to answer questions, only debate or rather, ahem, discuss. Seriously, thanks for telling me what the letters mean! No problem, these acronyms pop up everywhere. Yep, just Google them to get the info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members No Nicolaitans Posted June 27, 2012 Members Share Posted June 27, 2012 Another thing is, the SOTL claims to be an IFB publication, but they don't have an IFB as their editor. When Shelton Smith took over as Editor, I researched him, because I didn't know him. I thought that he was (and is) a "converted" IFB from the Southern Baptist Convention. In the little bit of research I did, I learned that he had taken the church that he pastored (in Maryland if I recall) out of the Southern Baptist Convention. Am I wrong about this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pastorj Posted June 27, 2012 Members Share Posted June 27, 2012 I know Shelton Smith and though I disagree with him on the doctrine of repentance, he is most definitely IFB. He leans more towards the Hyles crowd, but he is a good man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JerryNumbers Posted June 27, 2012 Members Share Posted June 27, 2012 When Shelton Smith took over as Editor, I researched him, because I didn't know him. I thought that he was (and is) a "converted" IFB from the Southern Baptist Convention. In the little bit of research I did, I learned that he had taken the church that he pastored (in Maryland if I recall) out of the Southern Baptist Convention. Am I wrong about this? Your 100% correct on he came out from among the SBC, he may have brought the church he was pastor out to. And he is conservative. Early on in his Sword of the Lord days he wrote a booklet laying out the problem with the SBC. Having been there he should know. No Nicolaitans 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jerry Posted June 27, 2012 Members Share Posted June 27, 2012 I don't know what Smith teaches about repentance - though he disagreed with Curtis Hutson's denial of repentance not being necessary for salvation. I think Shelton Smith re-edited their hymnal to fix Hutson's edits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pastorj Posted June 27, 2012 Members Share Posted June 27, 2012 He wrote a series of articles on the topic of Repentance earlier this year. He came to the conclusion that repentance is simply changing your mind and therefore confession of sin is not necessary for Salvation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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