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John81

Corrie ten Boom on the Tribulation and the Rapture

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Here is Corrie’s exhortation to us from a letter she wrote in 1974.
The world is deathly ill. It is dying. The Great Physician has already signed the death certificate. Yet there is still a great work for Christians to do. They are to be streams of living water, channels of mercy to those who are still in the world. It is possible for them to do this because they are overcomers.
Christians are ambassadors for Christ. They are representatives from Heaven to this dying world. And because of our presence here, things will change.
My sister, Betsy, and I were in the Nazi concentration camp at Ravensbruck because we committed the crime of loving Jews. Seven hundred of us from Holland, France, Russia, Poland and Belgium were herded into a room built for two hundred. As far as I knew, Betsy and I were the only two representatives of Heaven in that room.
We may have been the Lord’s only representatives in that place of hatred; yet because of our presence there, things changed. Jesus said, “In the world you shall have tribulation; but be of good cheer, I have overcome the world.” We too, are to be overcomers — bringing the light of Jesus into a world filled with darkness and hate.
corriebible.jpgSometimes I get frightened as I read the Bible, and as I look in this world and see all of the tribulation and persecution promised by the Bible coming true. Now I can tell you, though, if you too are afraid, that I have just read the last pages. I can now come to shouting “Hallelujah! Hallelujah!” for I have found where it is written that Jesus said, “He that overcometh shall inherit all things: and I will be His God, and he shall be My son.” This is the future and hope of this world. Not that the world will survive — but that we shall be overcomers in the midst of a dying world.
Betsy and I, in the concentration camp, prayed that God would heal Betsy who was so weak and sick. “Yes, the Lord will heal me,” Betsy said with confidence. She died the next day and I could not understand it. They laid her thin body on the concrete floor along with all the other corpses of the women who died that day.
It was hard for me to understand, to believe that God had a purpose for all that. Yet because of Betsy's death, today I am traveling all over the world telling people about Jesus.
There are some among us teaching there will be no tribulation, that the Christians will be able to escape all this. These are some of the false teachers that Jesus was warning us to expect in the latter days. Most of them have little knowledge of what is already going on across the world. I have been in countries where the saints are already suffering terrible persecution.
In China, the Christians were told, “Don't worry, before the tribulation comes you will be translated — raptured.” Then came a terrible persecution. Millions of Christians were tortured to death. Later I heard a Bishop from China say, sadly,

We have failed. We should have made the people strong for persecution rather than telling them Jesus would come first. Tell the people how to be strong in times of persecution, how to stand when the tribulation comes — to stand and n
ot
fai
nt
.


I feel I have a divine mandate to go and tell the people of this world that it is possible to be strong in the Lord Jesus Christ. We are in training for the tribulation, but more than sixty percent of the Body of Christ across the world has already entered into the tribulation. There is no way to escape it. We are next.

Since I have already gone through prison for Jesus’ sake, and since I met the Bishop in China, now every time I read a good Bible text I think, “Hey, I can use that in the time of tribulation." Then I write it down and learn it by heart.
When I was in the concentration camp, a camp where only twenty percent of the women came out alive, we tried to cheer each other up by saying, “Nothing could be any worse than today.” But we would find the next day was even worse. During this time a Bible verse that I had committed to memory gave me great hope and joy:

If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you; on their part evil is spoken of, but on your part He is glorified (1 Peter 3:14).


I found myself saying, “Hallelujah! Because I am suffering, Jesus is glorified!”

In America, the churches sing, “Let the congregation escape tribulation,” but in China and Africa the tribulation has already arrived. This last year alone, more than two hundred thousand Christians were martyred in Africa. Now things like that never get into the newspapers because they cause bad political relations. But I know. I have been there. We need to think about that when we sit down in our nice houses with our nice clothes to eat our steak dinners. Many, many members of the Body of Christ are being tortured to death at this very moment, yet we continue right on as though we are all going to escape the tribulation.
Several years ago I was in Africa in a nation where a new government had come into power. The first night I was there some of the Christians were commanded to come to the police station to register. When they arrived they were arrested and that same night they were executed. The next day the same thing happened with other Christians. The third day it was the same. All the Christians in the district were being systematically murdered.
The fourth day I was to speak in a little church. The people came, but they were filled with fear and tension. All during the service they were looking at each other, their eyes asking, “Will this one I am sitting beside be the next one killed? Will I be the next one?”
The room was hot and stuffy with insects that came through the screenless windows and swirled around the naked bulbs over the bare wooden benches. I told them a story out of my childhood.
“When I was a little girl,” I said, “I went to my father and said, ‘Daddy, I am afraid that I will never be strong enough to be a marty for Jesus Christ.’”
“Tell me,” said Father, “When you take a train trip to Amsterdam, when do I give you the money for the ticket? Three weeks before?”
“No, Daddy, you give me the money for the ticket just before we get on the train.”
“That is right,” my father said, “and so it is with God’s strength. Our Father in Heaven knows when you will need the strength to be a martyr for Jesus Christ. He will supply all you need — just in time....”
My African friends were nodding and smiling. Suddenly a spirit of joy descended upon that church and the people began singing,

In the sweet, by and by, we shall meet on that beautiful shore.


Later that week, half the congregation of that church was executed. I heard later that the other half was killed some months ago.

But I must tell you something. I was so happy that the Lord used me to encourage these people, for unlike many of their leaders, I had the word of God. I had been to the Bible and discovered that Jesus said He had not only overcome the world, but to all those who remained faithful to the end, He would give a crown of life.
How can we get ready for the persecution? First we need to feed on the word of God, digest it, make it a part of our being. This will mean disciplined Bible study each day as we not only memorize long passages of scripture, but put the principles to work in our lives.
Next we need to develop a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. Not just the Jesus of yesterday, the Jesus of history, but the life-changing Jesus of today who is still alive and sitting at the right hand of God.
We must be filled with the Holy Spirit. This is no optional command of the Bible, it is absolutely necessary. Those earthly disciples could never have stood up under the persecution of the Jews and Romans had they not waited for Pentecost. Each of us needs our own personal Pentecost, the baptism of the Holy Spirit. We will never be able to stand in the tribulation without it.
In the coming persecution, we must be ready to help each other and encourage each other. But we must not wait until the tribulation comes before starting. The fruit of the Spirit should be the dominant force of every Christian’s life.
Many are fearful of the coming tribulation, they want to run. I, too, am a little bit afraid when I think that after all my eighty years, including the horrible Nazi concentration camp, that I might have to go through the tribulation also. But then I read the Bible and I am glad.
“When I am weak, then I shall be strong,” the Bible says. Betsy and I were prisoners for the Lord; we were so weak, but we got power because the Holy Spirit was on us. That mighty inner strengthening of the Holy Spirit helped us through. No, you will not be strong in yourself when the tribulation comes. Rather, you will be strong in the power of Him who will not forsake you. For seventy-six years I have known the Lord Jesus and not once has He ever left me, or let me down.
“Though He slay me, yet will I trust Him,” for I know that to all who overcome, He shall give the crown of life. Hallelujah!

Corrie ten Boom—1974

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If Americans needed this message in 1974, they certainly need it much more today.

I know so many professing Christians who are so unprepared for any persecution or tribulation in their lives. They have been told so many times the Lord will keep them from such they see no need to spiritually prepare.

Many, over the course of the years, have come upon hard times that nearly extinquished their faith. They were so unprepared, so shocked and without proper guidance some are nearly spiritual zombies, going through the motions but little more because they were so overwhelmed.

All around I hear Christians saying nothing really bad will happen before Jesus takes them away. They have not been taught that all true followers of Christ WILL face persecution and that trials and tribulations are part of life. Seeing no need to be prepared for such, most have also been taught little or nothing about actually pursuing holiness, surrendering their lives to Christ. They don't get the importance, the necessity of continually reading and studying the Word, daily prayer, daily surrender of self, obeying the Word, following God.

Look around at the large numbers of Christians in America today who are too afraid to even mention the name of Jesus for fear of being made fun of! Not fear of beating, torture or death, but of simply being made fun of!

Then look at all those who think it's terrible persecution if someone doesn't like the term "Merry Christmas"!

Most Christians in America are spiritually very weak. They have a very limited walk with Christ, limited understanding of Scripture, very limited amount of Scripture memorized, no real concept of what it means to actually follow Jesus.

Should we not be teaching and helping one another to grow in Christ, to be strong in the Lord, to stand firm in Christ, prepared for whatever might and will come in trials, tribulations and persecutions?

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She definitely was one of the "righteous Gentiles". Have you ever seen the movie "The Hiding Place" about her ordeal in the concentration camp? Very moving indeed.

Edited by Wilchbla

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Ah, yes, that great theologian, Corrie Ten Boom.....
A true Bible Believing Dispensationalist does NOT believe that Christians in this age will escape PERSECUTION:
2 Timothy 3:12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.

We believe that we will be caught up to Heaven before a period of time that Jesus Christ called "the Great Tribulation:"
Matthew 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

(I am still having trouble understanding how 70 AD could have been the worst period of time since the Garden of Eden!)

John, thank you so much for doing such a wonderful job of misrepresenting Dispensationalism AGAIN!
I would have thought that after studying the subject for 30 years that you would have a better grasp on our position!

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Ah, yes, that great theologian, Corrie Ten Boom.....
A true Bible Believing Dispensationalist does NOT believe that Christians in this age will escape PERSECUTION:
2 Timothy 3:12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.

We believe that we will be caught up to Heaven before a period of time that Jesus Christ called "the Great Tribulation:"
Matthew 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
Please read 2 Thes. 1 - the so-called rapture does not leave the wicked to live on, except in the eternal tribulation of hell.

(I am still having trouble understanding how 70 AD could have been the worst period of time since the Garden of Eden!)

The persecution that Christians suffer in the Gospel age is at the hands of evil men, who are under the judgment of God. 2 Thes. 1 spells this out in stark clarity. The tribulation evil men will suffer is not described as 7 years, but:
9
Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

10
When he shall come to be glorified in his sai
nt
s, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.


The essential difference between the AD 70 great tribulation & all other tribulations is that is was decreed by God for their persistent rejection of their Messiah & the Gospel of peace proclaimed by the Apostles. The flood was a quick death by drowning, without tribulation, & other persecutions both of Christians & Jews have been at the hands of wicked men acting against God. The Babylonian destruction was for the ultimate blessing of those carried away, as many would return to rebuild the temple & city ready for Messiah. AD 70 was, as Luke writes:
22
For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.

23
But woe u
nt
o them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.

24
And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive i
nt
o all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Ge
nt
iles, u
nt
il the times of the Ge
nt
iles be fulfilled.


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(I am still having trouble understanding how 70 AD could have been the worst period of time since the Garden of Eden!)



You keep misquoting that scripture. It does not say it is the worst. Read it again and again. It says

Mt 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation,such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

Mr 13:19 For in those days shall be affliction,such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.

It was different in kind, not in intensity. Edited by Invicta

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Ah, yes, that great theologian, Corrie Ten Boom.....
A true Bible Believing Dispensationalist does NOT believe that Christians in this age will escape PERSECUTION:
2 Timothy 3:12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.

We believe that we will be caught up to Heaven before a period of time that Jesus Christ called "the Great Tribulation:"
Matthew 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

(I am still having trouble understanding how 70 AD could have been the worst period of time since the Garden of Eden!)

John, thank you so much for doing such a wonderful job of misrepresenting Dispensationalism AGAIN!
I would have thought that after studying the subject for 30 years that you would have a better grasp on our position!

Wow! Are you really that stuck on dispensationalism to think that everything you read is about that?

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Wow! Are you really that stuck on dispensationalism to think that everything you read is about that?

John, Please!
Look at the title of your thread! What are the implications? What exactly are you trying to say?
Considering the content of the "Letter" it would appear that this is an subtle attack on The Tribulation and Rapture - Dispensational teachings. Corrie Ten Boom's position is UNMISTAKABLE.
If you did not intend that, then maybe you should consider a different title for the thread, to avoid the confusion.
I read your post, but the content of the letter and the misleading title is what I am going by, coupled with your well-stated position AGAINST dispensationalism. Edited by Steve Schwenke

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John, Please!
Look at the title of your thread! What are the implications? What exactly are you trying to say?
Considering the content of the "Letter" it would appear that this is an subtle attack on The Tribulation and Rapture - Dispensational teachings. Corrie Ten Boom's position is UNMISTAKABLE.
If you did not intend that, then maybe you should consider a different title for the thread, to avoid the confusion.
I read your post, but the content of the letter and the misleading title is what I am going by, coupled with your well-stated position AGAINST dispensationalism.

I used the title they gave with what she put forth, I didn't create it myself. I also don't see dispensationalism mentioned anywhere.

Did you read what I posted?

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John, Please!
Look at the title of your thread! What are the implications? What exactly are you trying to say?
Considering the content of the "Letter" it would appear that this is an subtle attack on The Tribulation and Rapture - Dispensational teachings. Corrie Ten Boom's position is UNMISTAKABLE.
If you did not intend that, then maybe you should consider a different title for the thread, to avoid the confusion.
I read your post, but the content of the letter and the misleading title is what I am going by, coupled with your well-stated position AGAINST dispensationalism.

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Corrie Ten Boom was a Dutch Calvinist who became Charismatic toward the end of her life. I wouldn't go to her for grounding in doctrine. But that being said she was a greater Christian than I could ever imagine to be.

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Corrie Ten Boom was a Dutch Calvinist who became Charismatic toward the end of her life. I wouldn't go to her for grounding in doctrine. But that being said she was a greater Christian than I could ever imagine to be.

As the post of my own indicates, the posting of what she had to say was not a matter of doctrine, but one of exhortation.

I believe we need the exhortation to live a holy life, to draw ever closer to the Lord, to surrender our lives to His will, to be rooted and grounded in His Word so we may stand firm in Christ no matter what comes into our lives.

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Remember, Bro. Steve, dispenationalism is not a monolith. Pretribulation rapture, though popular, is just one way of explaining the sequence of events. There are and have been legitimate, orthodox, alternatives stated by authentic bible believers over the centuries of church history.

If you knew there was the possibility of a "pop-test" on Monday, (remembering school days,) you'd be ready. Though we would all prefer to go "up" prior to any tribulation, there is the possibility that it could happen otherwise. The predominance of evidence points to a different end times scenario than we have formulated so precisely, these past 150 years.

When it comes to an issues with such mystery sown all through it, openness is a position to take as well as readiness.

Remember the pop test.

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Baptists have been known to rely heavily upon the Pauline Epistles for the meat of our doctrine. I am not dismissing the OT (Romans 15:4!), but what I am saying that those who teach a post-tribulation rapture of the church rely upon Matthew, Mark, and REvelation for their sources, and dismiss the Pauline Epistles as unclear or irrelevant to the subject, or even worse, as supportive of the Gospels and REvelation, rather than separate. Paul teaches a Pre-Tribulation rapture in I Corinthians 15 and I Thessalonians 4.

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Baptists have been known to rely heavily upon the Pauline Epistles for the meat of our doctrine. I am not dismissing the OT (Romans 15:4!), but what I am saying that those who teach a post-tribulation rapture of the church rely upon Matthew, Mark, and REvelation for their sources, and dismiss the Pauline Epistles as unclear or irrelevant to the subject, or even worse, as supportive of the Gospels and REvelation, rather than separate. Paul teaches a Pre-Tribulation rapture in I Corinthians 15 and I Thessalonians 4.

Perhaps, but then again many fine men of God have viewed those verses differently over the centuries and even today.

In the same manner, most of the Jewish religious leaders thought they fully understood the prophecy of the coming Messiah yet they turned out to be very wrong. They were so set upon their viewpoint that their hearts were hardened to the truth when the Messiah stood before them.

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John, I do not believe the Lord wants us to be agnostics when it comes to Bible doctrine. (The Latin word for "agnostic" is ignoramus.) God wants us to KNOW sound doctrine. In fact, "doctrine" is the first word mentioned as to the profitability of the Scriptures - II Timothy 3:16-17. I simply will not buy into this modern day lazy-itus that says that we can NOT know - We can! John 16:13 gives the promise that the Holy Spirit will lead us into ALL TRUTH.
Will there be disagreements? Sure thing!
Are there non-essential doctrines that we might debate? Yep!
Are there minor variations on doctrines that we might disagree on? Absolutely!
But I absolutely refuse to accept this Laodicean tendency to take a stand on sound doctrine because someone else teaches something different.

I believe my position is correct, and that conclusion comes AFTER considering all sides of the question to the best of my ability. (That consideration includes studying, reading various authors and viewpoints, but most importantly the BIBLE and PRAYER.)
The OT prophets didn't stand up and say, "I think this is what God wanted me to say, but I could be wrong, since the Scribes and Priests have a different interpretation."
Nope - they said with great certainty "THUS SAITH THE LORD."
I believe this is one element that is greatly LACKING in our modern pulpits.

Is there a possibility that my view is incorrect? Yes there is a possibility - nobody is infallible, and I am not claiming to be. If I am wrong, then I trust in the Lord to reveal that to me in my time of Bible Study and prayer.

But until that time comes, I will continue to assert my views dogmatically.
If I am unsure, I am silent until I receive assurance from the Lord through prayer and study.

In Christ,

Edited by Steve Schwenke

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If God had intended that we know the end times perfectly He would have given it to us very clearly. The very fact that so many who were mighty through Christ have come to various plausible views, and the fact the end times are not put forth directly, but in a manner similar to the first advent prophecies, indicates this.

What is very clear from Scripture is that we are supposed to be ready at all times, being busy doing the Father's will and growing in Christlikeness so that when Christ returns we will be found ready.

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Baptists have been known to rely heavily upon the Pauline Epistles for the meat of our doctrine. I am not dismissing the OT (Romans 15:4!), but what I am saying that those who teach a post-tribulation rapture of the church rely upon Matthew, Mark, and REvelation for their sources, and dismiss the Pauline Epistles as unclear or irrelevant to the subject, or even worse, as supportive of the Gospels and REvelation, rather than separate. Paul teaches a Pre-Tribulation rapture in I Corinthians 15 and I Thessalonians 4.


I have read both of these chapters again and cannot find the least hint of a pre tribulation rapture,

1 Cor:15: 51 ¶ Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?
56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.
57 But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Is it in the above verses? If so, where?

1 Thess. 4:13 ¶ But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.
1 ¶ But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.
6 ¶ Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.


Again, I ask, "Is it in the above verses? If so, where?"

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Baptists have been known to rely heavily upon the Pauline Epistles for the meat of our doctrine. I am not dismissing the OT (Romans 15:4!), but what I am saying that those who teach a post-tribulation rapture of the church rely upon Matthew, Mark, and REvelation for their sources, and dismiss the Pauline Epistles as unclear or irrelevant to the subject, or even worse, as supportive of the Gospels and REvelation, rather than separate. Paul teaches a Pre-Tribulation rapture in I Corinthians 15 and I Thessalonians 4.


Sequence of events:

1. The resurrection of the dead in Christ.
2. The rapture of those alive and remaining.
3. The rest of the end time events. . . right?

1 Cor. 15
[22] For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
[23] But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
[24] Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
[25] For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

1. Christ, (obviously,) the firstfruits of resurrection.
2. They that are his, (dead and alive,) AT his coming.
3. Then cometh the end when he shall deliver up the kingdom and put down all power.

If you're going to use 1 Cor. 15, there is room there for a post or late tribulation rapture. Paul was not THAT specific.

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2 Thess 2:1 ¶ Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3 ¶ Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

No trace of pre tribulation rapture here.

Note the sequence of events. That day, your "rapture" shall not come, except there come a falling away first, the great apoatacy. and I take that as the great apostacy which led to the Roman Catholic church , then the man of sin will be revealed, the papacy.

The sequence is:
1 Great apostacy
2. Man of sin reavealed
3 Our meeting with the Lord.

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Yes; I agree that Cory Ten Boom's letter was specifically targeted to preachers and against the seven year tribulation teaching as she believed that we are now in tribulation. And we are: ~100mm Christians killed in the last 50 yrs. That is a very significant number by anyone's standards.

As I recall ~165AD Irenaus taught or stated a 6,000 year period of earth or beginning to end 6000 yrs. It all began ~6000 yrs ago and now we know that since Jesus' resurrection has been ~2000 yrs.

Satan is placed in a bottomless pit. Unloosed for a little season in 1000 yrs and then cast back into the bottomless pit. Now for a final time he is loosed to go about to deceive the nation and then destroyed and cast into the lake of fire for eternity. How much time has passed in this period? Isn't this Lucifer that is loosed? Has this same Lucifer caused this in the past? In Eze 208 we see Lucifer as King Tyrus and his building his empire and controlling the money trafficking and trading and setting prices. At a time of Melchizedek when basically a famine pushed Jacob (Israel) in Egypt for what I think a two-fold reason - 1.) destroy King Tyrus and 2.) punishment for the selling of Joseph of which he had to be re-united. Isn't this same Lucifer setup today as in exactly the same manner? Aren't the nations deceived now? Doesn't the god of this world have them in a position where he can control events? What is folks take on this?

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we are: ~100mm Christians killed in the last 50 yrs. That is a very significant number by anyone's standards.

Sam, you have said this before and I have asked you for evidence and you have not supplied it. The figure you give is 2,000.000 a year. Can you justify that claim?

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I had heard that number from several. Then one day not too long ago Adrian Rogers made the statement on his radio program (he is deceased, so the program has some age to it). That prompted me to start searching due to his credibility. It has been a number of months back; but, it was fairly easy to search it out. Bill Clinton said only a few months ago that his biggest regret was that he didn't intervene to stop many of the killings (live on TV in USA). No one can justify an atrocity. But,the claim as to its being realistic has to be somewhat close from all I read. If it were 10mm; that number would be a wow in my book. Those are the numbers given by many credible people of which all seemed to be real-deal Christians. I'd have to track it again; I'll check my bookmarks or you can do a search. I know many are being killed in USA.

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