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    • By 1Timothy115 in Devotionals
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      Psalms 119:1-8                                         Sep. 5 - Oct. 2, 2019
      1 ALEPH. Blessed are the undefiled in the way, who walk in the law of the LORD.
      2 Blessed are they that keep his testimonies, and that seek him with the whole heart.
      3 They also do no iniquity: they walk in his ways.
      4 Thou hast commanded us to keep thy precepts diligently.
      5 O that my ways were directed to keep thy statutes!
      6 Then shall I not be ashamed, when I have respect unto all thy commandments.
      7 I will praise thee with uprightness of heart, when I shall have learned thy righteous judgments.
      8 I will keep thy statutes: O forsake me not utterly.
      The following verse stood out to me...
      5 O that my ways were directed to keep thy statutes!
      At first glance it seemed to me this person’s soul is poured out with intense desire to have God’s direction in keeping His Word.
      I made a small wood fire in our backyard for my granddaughter, Julia, since she would be staying overnight with us. My wife and Julia stayed outside at the fire for about half an hour. Then, I found myself alone to watch the fire die out on a particularly lovely evening. So I took my verse from above and began to repeat it for memorization. As I repeated the verse, I tried to contemplate the words and apply them to what I was seeing around me. 
      The moon and stars were out now peering through the scattered clouds above.
      [Genesis 1:16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. Genesis 1:17 And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth, Genesis 1:18 And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.]
      Thought 1         
      The moon has stayed his course since the day God created him, also the stars, obeying the statutes directed by God from the first day they were created. Can you imagine God’s direction to the Moon and stars, “moon you will have a path through the sky above the earth, stars you will occupy the firmament above the moon and be clearly visible in the cloudless night sky.”
      Then, the trees, grass, even the air we breathe obey the statues God gave them from the beginning. None of these creations have souls, none have hearts, none have intelligence, but they all observe God’s statutes, His instructions for their limited time on earth.
      Thought 2
      What if we were like the moon, stars, trees, grass, or the other creations which have no soul? We would be directed to keep God’s statutes without choosing to keep them. This is not the image of God, there would be no dominion over other creatures, or over the earth. We would not be capable of experiencing the joy and peace of learning the love of God
      Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
      Philippians 4:7 And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.
      Thought 3 (October 2, 2019)
      Is the psalmist pleading God to force God’s statutes to become the man’s ways? No, he is speaking of his own failure in keeping God’s statutes and his desire to keep them, very much like Paul in Romans 7:14-25.
      God doesn’t work through force to turn men from their ways that they would desire His statutes or desire God Himself. Men must reject (repent) put aside his own ways and voluntarily seek God and His statutes.

Suicide and salvation?

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I might add Linda, there's many people that cause me to doubt their salvation with the life they live, & partaking of so many ungodly things.

And I feel sure nearly all of us have done things in our lives that's caused fellow Christians do doubt our salvation.

Thankfully we are not in a race for performance based salvation, of course all of us have probably grew up in homes & school that are totally based on performance.

We must remember, our salvation is not based on our righteousness, but on the Saviors righteousness, plus God's mercy & grace.

I was married to a man who "professed" Christ and CONTINUED to live in sin... his lifestyle was ungodly after salvation. I was told that since he made that profession he was saved and it didn't matter how he lived afterwards and he would go to heaven when he died. This lie is in contrary to God's Word (Romans 6:1-2 and elsewhere).

Nobody is ever going to be sinlessly perfect this side of heaven, but salvation does make a difference. How you walk in your Christian life should reflect Christ...but we all fall short and miss the mark. A sinful lifestyle should not be the "fruit" of the Christian's life. A sinful lifestyle runs contrary to being a "new creature in Christ Jesus".

I realize that our salvation isn't based on our righteousness, but on the blood of Jesus Christ and His righteousness is imputed to us.

My question to everyone is this: Does it matter how we live AFTER salvation? IMHO, suicide is the "cowardly" way out of trials and tribulations and the Christian has no justification to take his/her own life. That's for God to decide.
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Suicide is rejection of the leading of the Holy Spirit. Suicide proves one is following another shepherd and not Jesus Christ. Suicide denies Christ.

All sin is a rejection of the leading of the Holy Spirit, not just suicide. Each time you or I sin, we have rejected the leading of the Holy Spirit yet that doesn't mean we are not saved.

Suicide, like any other sin a believer may commit, only proves one has given in to a paticular sin at that moment, not that they are denying Christ.
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My question to everyone is this: Does it matter how we live AFTER salvation? IMHO, suicide is the "cowardly" way out of trials and tribulations and the Christian has no justification to take his/her own life. That's for God to decide.

Yes, it matters how we live after salvation. Scripture is clear we are to pursue holiness. We should grow in Christlikeness. At the same time, Scripture is equally clear that so long as we are on this earth believers will commit sin.

I agree that most suicides are cowardly and simply someone trying to run from something. Most suicides are commited by lost people. Suicide, like many other sins, should be very rare among Christians, and yes I agree suicide is a sin because it is the murder of oneself and also we are told that we have been bought with a price and do not belong to ourselves.

For the most part, I think if a Christian is tempted to commit suicide and they actually pause and think about it they will hear from the Holy Ghost and not give in to that temptation to sin. However, there are cases where one commits a sin very quickly upon the temptation coming upon them, whether it be suicide, murder, lying, or whatever.

No doubt suicide should be very rare among Christians, as should sins like murder, adultery, lying, etc. Yet just because a person commits one of these sins, or dies while commiting one of these sins, doesn't mean they were never born again in Christ.
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Rick,

I'll thank you to stop bearing false witness against me. I also ask that if you are going to refer to me in a post, use it as it is, Standing Firm In Christ, not your mockery of my character.

My beliefs are based on the Word of God. I have posted Scripture that clearly supports my beliefs concerning suicide.

As yet, you have not.



You've posted nothing that proves that every person who committed suicide went to Hell.

Yes, I made fun of you a little. I didn't lie though. You have no evidence for your position.

As far as making fun of you, here are the seven reasons why you are Stubborn in Your Own Unbiblical Opinion:

1. You believe in the Calvinist doctrine of Preservance of the Saints whether you know it or not. You're teaching that every person who dies in a backslidden state was never saved to begin with, something the Bible never teaches at all. Why again are you not preaching that Matthew 24:13 is part of the plan of salvation?

2. I've shown examples of backslidden saints who died, or were close to dying. Your answer is that none of them were saved and they all went to Hell. You have no evidence for this. I have presented evidence that they were saved. You ignore it and ramble on about other things.

3. You claim no Christian can commit suicide. You have no evidence for this. I have shown that Christians can commit fornication, adultery, murder, and any other sin imaginable because they have the same old nature that a lost man has.

4. You have dismissed the ten consequences for rebellion that a Christian suffers who refuses to get right. Perhaps it hasn't dawned on you that those ten consequences are there for a reason - sometimes Christians with their free will choose to not ever get right.

5. You have ignored the fact that the Bible clearly teaches that Jesus Christ saves us from all sin. You think He can't save someone from the sin of suicide.

6. Your stand is completely inconsistent. You send all drunks to Hell, but ignore the liars in the same verse in Revelation. Self-murders go to Hell, but people who murder other people do not necessarily go. Adulterers are okay (like David), but the fornicator that God was getting ready to kill in I Cor. 5 was never saved (and the Bible says his spirit WAS SAVED).

7. You have ignored the fact that suicide is not the worst sin a person can commit and it isn't always in direct rebellion to God. You are being ignorant of the facts about that particular sin and the real world around you. Many times Christians feel hopeless and kill themselves and it has nothing to do with rebellion to God. It's a terrible thing, but you in your heartlessness have automatically sent them all to Hell. This is why I don’t feel bad about not cutting you any slack on this. If I believed what you do in Christian discernment I would keep my mouth shut so as to not rub salt in the wounds of others. I sincerely hope that no one who has family member who have committed suicide run into you and your 'encouraging' and 'uplifting' dogma.
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I realize that our salvation isn't based on our righteousness, but on the blood of Jesus Christ and His righteousness is imputed to us.

My question to everyone is this: Does it matter how we live AFTER salvation? IMHO, suicide is the "cowardly" way out of trials and tribulations and the Christian has no justification to take his/her own life. That's for God to decide.


I appreciate that you have been reasonable and rational in this discussion, sister. Absolutely our actions after salvation matter, and if someone lived wickedly before and after salvation with no evidence of fruit at any time in their lives I would assume they probably never got saved.

Suicide is a sin, and it is cowardice. But so are a lot of sins we do, thank God for His grace that saves and forgives us of all sin!
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All sin is a rejection of the leading of the Holy Spirit, not just suicide. Each time you or I sin, we have rejected the leading of the Holy Spirit yet that doesn't mean we are not saved.

Suicide, like any other sin a believer may commit, only proves one has given in to a paticular sin at that moment, not that they are denying Christ.
Suicide is the ultimate rejection, of which you can't repent. One dies in one's sins, one dies without hope. End of story.
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You've posted nothing that proves that every person who committed suicide went to Hell.

Yes, I made fun of you a little. I didn't lie though. You have no evidence for your position.

As far as making fun of you, here are the seven reasons why you are Stubborn in Your Own Unbiblical Opinion:

1. You believe in the Calvinist doctrine of Preservance of the Saints whether you know it or not. You're teaching that every person who dies in a backslidden state was never saved to begin with, something the Bible never teaches at all. Why again are you not preaching that Matthew 24:13 is part of the plan of salvation?

2. I've shown examples of backslidden saints who died, or were close to dying. Your answer is that none of them were saved and they all went to Hell. You have no evidence for this. I have presented evidence that they were saved. You ignore it and ramble on about other things.

3. You claim no Christian can commit suicide. You have no evidence for this. I have shown that Christians can commit fornication, adultery, murder, and any other sin imaginable because they have the same old nature that a lost man has.

4. You have dismissed the ten consequences for rebellion that a Christian suffers who refuses to get right. Perhaps it hasn't dawned on you that those ten consequences are there for a reason - sometimes Christians with their free will choose to not ever get right.

5. You have ignored the fact that the Bible clearly teaches that Jesus Christ saves us from all sin. You think He can't save someone from the sin of suicide.

6. Your stand is completely inconsistent. You send all drunks to Hell, but ignore the liars in the same verse in Revelation. Self-murders go to Hell, but people who murder other people do not necessarily go. Adulterers are okay (like David), but the fornicator that God was getting ready to kill in I Cor. 5 was never saved (and the Bible says his spirit WAS SAVED).

7. You have ignored the fact that suicide is not the worst sin a person can commit and it isn't always in direct rebellion to God. You are being ignorant of the facts about that particular sin and the real world around you. Many times Christians feel hopeless and kill themselves and it has nothing to do with rebellion to God. It's a terrible thing, but you in your heartlessness have automatically sent them all to Hell. This is why I don’t feel bad about not cutting you any slack on this. If I believed what you do in Christian discernment I would keep my mouth shut so as to not rub salt in the wounds of others. I sincerely hope that no one who has family member who have committed suicide run into you and your 'encouraging' and 'uplifting' dogma.
I see you still have no Scripture to refute my belief. I didn't think you did.

On the other hand, I have plenty of Scripture to show suicide is an act denying Christ, rejecting His gift of life eternal. Suicide is murder, and we know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him. No murderer. That means, because the suicide is not capable of repenting of his murder, he does not have eternal life. He has proven that he was not saved at all.
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Suicide is the ultimate rejection, of which you can't repent. One dies in one's sins, one dies without hope. End of story.

According to Scripture that's NOT the end of story. Nowhere does Scripture say that every sin one commits must be repented of before they die or they will go to hell. I have heard Catholics teach that, but it's not Scripture.

If a Christian dies while having a sinful thought, do you believe that means they go to hell?

If a Christian dies while commiting adultery, do you believe they go to hell?

If a Christian dies as they gossip with a friend, do you believe they go to hell?

When a Christian is born again they forgiven of all sins, past, present and future. Christ died for all our sins on Calvary, not just some of them, not just those committed prior to our being born again, and not only for those we specifically repent of after salvation, but ALL of our sins.
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No doubt suicide should be very rare among Christians, as should sins like murder, adultery, lying, etc. Yet just because a person commits one of these sins, or dies while commiting one of these sins, doesn't mean they were never born again in Christ.
Suicide is already non-existent in Christians, why call for rare occasions of it?
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1 John 3:15 Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.

Suicide is murder. One who kills himself is a murderer. He does not have eternal life abiding in him. He proves his lost estate.

If that verse were taken as you proclaim then no one who ever commited murder, whether physically or in their heart could be saved.

That verse doesn't mean that a Christian who commits murder or suicide immediately prior to death was never saved. This verse is speaking to those who profess faith yet harbor hatred for others in their hearts.

If you die while having a sinful thought or in the midst of committing a sin do you believe you will go to hell?
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I was married to a man who "professed" Christ and CONTINUED to live in sin... his lifestyle was ungodly after salvation. I was told that since he made that profession he was saved and it didn't matter how he lived afterwards and he would go to heaven when he died. This lie is in contrary to God's Word (Romans 6:1-2 and elsewhere).

Nobody is ever going to be sinlessly perfect this side of heaven, but salvation does make a difference. How you walk in your Christian life should reflect Christ...but we all fall short and miss the mark. A sinful lifestyle should not be the "fruit" of the Christian's life. A sinful lifestyle runs contrary to being a "new creature in Christ Jesus".

I realize that our salvation isn't based on our righteousness, but on the blood of Jesus Christ and His righteousness is imputed to us.

My question to everyone is this: Does it matter how we live AFTER salvation? IMHO, suicide is the "cowardly" way out of trials and tribulations and the Christian has no justification to take his/her own life. That's for God to decide.


Yes, it matters how we live, but our salvation is not based on how we live our life, its based on Jesus. And there is no justification for any sin. Yet there is only one sin that the blood of the 'Lamb of God' will not cover.

And even though the save man may commit suicide, he is still saved.

And just because the saved man committed suicide, of which he cannot repent, his salvation was guaranteed the moment in his life that he accepted Jesus as Savior.
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If that verse were taken as you proclaim then no one who ever commited murder, whether physically or in their heart could be saved.

That verse doesn't mean that a Christian who commits murder or suicide immediately prior to death was never saved. This verse is speaking to those who profess faith yet harbor hatred for others in their hearts.

If you die while having a sinful thought or in the midst of committing a sin do you believe you will go to hell?
The difference is, the one who murders another has a chance to repent of that murder and seek God's forgiveness.
A suicide cannot be repented of.

You are comparing apples with oranges.
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I agree that most suicides are cowardly and simply someone trying to run from something. Most suicides are commited by lost people. Suicide, like many other sins, should be very rare among Christians, and yes I agree suicide is a sin because it is the murder of oneself and also we are told that we have been bought with a price and do not belong to ourselves.

For the most part, I think if a Christian is tempted to commit suicide and they actually pause and think about it they will hear from the Holy Ghost and not give in to that temptation to sin. However, there are cases where one commits a sin very quickly upon the temptation coming upon them, whether it be suicide, murder, lying, or whatever.

No doubt suicide should be very rare among Christians, as should sins like murder, adultery, lying, etc. Yet just because a person commits one of these sins, or dies while commiting one of these sins, doesn't mean they were never born again in Christ.

Suicide should not even exist among Christians. The desire of those who have put their faith in the Lord Jesus Christ should be to please Him because they love Him and desire to obey Him. Suicide takes God off the throne and puts "self" on the throne and then "self" determines when life should end. In the entire New Testament (except for Judas Isacariot, who went to "his own place") , there is no mention of suicide as a "way of escape" from trials and temptations. I find that strange in the face of the rising suicide rate among "professing" Christians. It's almost like suicide is becoming "acceptable" and justified in the Body of Christ. Just because someone makes a profession of faith doesn't mean they are saved any more than me being born in a bakery makes me a bagel!

Life and death are in God's hands. He is the One Who determines when our life will begin and when it will end.
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The difference is, the one who murders another has a chance to repent of that murder and seek God's forgiveness.
A suicide cannot be repented of.

You are comparing apples with oranges.

Not at all.

If you die while committing any sin you cannot repent of it. Does that mean you will go to hell?

You've been asked this and similar questions yet you don't answer.
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Suicide should not even exist among Christians. The desire of those who have put their faith in the Lord Jesus Christ should be to please Him because they love Him and desire to obey Him. Suicide takes God off the throne and puts "self" on the throne and then "self" determines when life should end. In the entire New Testament (except for Judas Isacariot, who went to "his own place") , there is no mention of suicide as a "way of escape" from trials and temptations. I find that strange in the face of the rising suicide rate among "professing" Christians. It's almost like suicide is becoming "acceptable" and justified in the Body of Christ. Just because someone makes a profession of faith doesn't mean they are saved any more than me being born in a bakery makes me a bagel!

Life and death are in God's hands. He is the One Who determines when our life will begin and when it will end.

There should be no sin among Christians but so long as we are in this fallen world living in our corrupt bodies of flesh all Christians will continue to commit sin.

It's very true that it is God who is to determine the beginning and end of life yet there are Christians who use "birth control" to prevent life, and most "birth control" also kills life in the earlies of stages, just as there are some Christians who will murder in heart of actually, and some will unfortunately give into the temptation to commit suicide.

Thanks be to God that through Christ all who are born again have been forgiven of all those sins.
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Not at all.

If you die while committing any sin you cannot repent of it. Does that mean you will go to hell?

You've been asked this and similar questions yet you don't answer.
I have answered. You just don't like the answer. It does not matter if one made a profession of faith and walked like a Christian, talked like a Christian, behaved like a Christian for 40 years of one's life. If that person decided to go out and commit adultery and had a heart attack in the course of that act, that man would go to hell. He died an adulterer. He did not repent of his adultery. All adulterers will have their part with the lake of fire. That which was in his heart was manifest. His heart was deceitful and desperately wicked and the thoughts of his heart surfaced to prove that those 40 years, the cup was clean on the outside but filthy on the inside.

Same with a suicide. The heart truly was not changed. The pig that was washed returned to the mire because the old nature was still there. He was not in Christ at all.

The works of the flesh are manifest which are these... they which do such things SHALL NOT inherit the Kingdom of God.

Now, some might say that is speaking of inheritance, and not of Salvation. But wait, all those born into the Kingdom of God are heirs.

Romans 8:17-18 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us. Edited by Standing Firm In Christ
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I have answered. You just don't like the answer. It does not matter if one made a profession of faith and walked like a Christian, talked like a Christian, behaved like a Christian for 40 years of one's life. If that person decided to go out and commit adultery and had a heart attack in the course of that act, that man would go to hell. He died an adulterer. He did not repent of his adultery. All adulterers will have their part with the lake of fire. That which was in his heart was manifest. His heart was deceitful and desperately wicked and the thoughts of his heart surfaced to prove that those 40 years, the cup was clean on the outside but filthy on the inside.

Same with a suicide. The heart truly was not changed. The pig that was washed returned to the mire because the old nature was still there. He was not in Christ at all.

The works of the flesh are manifest which are these... they which do such things SHALL NOT inherit the Kingdom of God.

Now, some might say that is speaking of inheritance, and not of Salvation. But wait, all those born into the Kingdom of God are heirs.

Romans 8:17-18 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.


Your salvation is based on works if I read the highlighted portion correctly:

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Nowhere does this verse state "through faith AND REPENTANCE"
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Apparently you didn't read it correctly.

It is God who gives repentance to man.
2 Timothy 2:25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

That repentance is given because of godly sorrow.
2 Corinthians 7:9 Now I rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrowed to repentance: for ye were made sorry after a godly manner, that ye might receive damage by us in nothing.
2 Corinthians 7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.

Obviously, the one who has committed suicide cannot repent unto Salvation. He was never saved to begin with.

When one rightly divides the Word of Truth, one sees that repentance is a prerequisite to Salvation. If one does not repent, that one cannot be saved.

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Apparently you didn't read it correctly.

It is God who gives repentance to man.
2 Timothy 2:25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

That repentance is given because of godly sorrow.
2 Corinthians 7:9 Now I rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrowed to repentance: for ye were made sorry after a godly manner, that ye might receive damage by us in nothing.
2 Corinthians 7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.

Obviously, the one who has committed suicide cannot repent unto Salvation. He was never saved to begin with.

When one rightly divides the Word of Truth, one sees that repentance is a prerequisite to Salvation. If one does not repent, that one cannot be saved.


Oh sorry!! My bad!! Your salvation is not works based. I apologize, must need glasses. I see now your salvation is repentance based. Is repentance not a work?
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