Suicide and salvation?

[John81]

The one who commits suicide proves he or she was not born again. In committing suicide, he or she proves that when others thought he or she was saved in reality he or she was not, but only had an outward appearance with no inward change. A wolf in sheep's clothing.

Where does it say anywhere in Scripture that if one commits suicide that's proof they were not saved? It's simply not there. What is there is that ALL sins are forgiven at the time one comes to Christ and no matter what sin a Christian might be in when they die they will still be carried to heaven by the angels. They may lose rewards, but they are yet saved.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

If ‘ALL MURDERS’ are sent to hell them that means the sin of murder cannot be forgiven.

Have you ever heard about ‘GRACE?’ Without ‘GRACE’ not a single person would inherit Heaven.

Yet some seem to drop ‘GRACE’ from the equation when it pleases them.

You're really grasping at straws here Jerry. One murdering another can be repented of, if one chooses to repent.

Self-murder cannot be repented of. It is the ultimate act of selfishness and rebellion.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

Suicide is a grievous sin against God. Because it is the taking of life, suicide is murder; and it is never right. When one who professes to be a Christian commits suicide, serious doubts should be raised as to the authenticity of his or her profession. There is no hardship or trial that can justify a child of God, attempting to end his orher own life. We are instructed by God's Holy Word to live our lives for Him, and when we die is not ours todecide.

When one commits suicide, that one is placing himself in the position of God, declaring when his life is to end. God has already determined when we are to die, His Word tells us this. And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment. But we can shorten our lives through rebellion. Children honor your parents in the Lord for this is right. For this is the first commandment with promise.

Does God really have rebellious children in His Heaven? or does He have children who hear and follow Him? Nothing that defiles can enter Heaven... nothing. Yet some would have children of disobedience upon whom God's wrath is appointed defiling His habitation..

[JerryNumbers]

Of course God has rebellious children in heaven.

That is every single human being has rebelled from God, even after they have been saved, there was only one that no rebellion was found within Him, & thanks to Him, & grace, humans can be saved.

And we don't keep our self saved, God does that. Plus it would be impossible for us to keep our self saved.

[John81]

Of course God has rebellious children in heaven.

That is every single human being has rebelled from God, even after they have been saved, there was only one that no rebellion was found within Him, & thanks to Him, & grace, humans can be saved.

And we don't keep our self saved, God does that. Plus it would be impossible for us to keep our self saved.

Amen!

All sin is grievous before God. That not only includes suicide, but also lying, gossiping, committing homosexual acts, and according to Christ, even when we think about doing these things.

So true, we don't preserve or keep our own salvation by not sinning, or by not committing certain sins, or by making sure we repent of every sin before we die.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

Matthew 15:18-19 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man. For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:

One commits suicide because it is in one's heart to commit suicide. Suicide is murder and murder defiles.

Revelation 21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

Nothing that defiles will enter God's Kingdom... nothing.

1 Samuel 15:23 For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from being king.

Suicide is an act or rebellion, it is as the sin of witchcraft. Stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Instead of submitting to the leading and guidance of the Holy Spirit, the one who committed suicide stubbornly chose a different method of solving his or her problems.

And God sees their rebellion and stubbornness the same as He sees witchcraft and idolatry.

Suicides are the result of an evil heart, one that knows not God.

[LindaR]

Rebellious children in heaven? Not according to Revelation 21:8, 27; 22:3, 15:

Revelation 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

Revelation 21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

Revelation 22:3 And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:

Revelation 22:15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

Sin of any kind does not occur in a vacuum:

James 1:13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

James 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.

James 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

James 1:16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.

Salvation does not eradicate our sin nature...we all have one and we all sin, even after salvation. But we need not "live in the mire of sin" and sin should not be our lifestyle after we are saved. We don't become "sinless", but we do "sin less".

Romans 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?

Romans 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

1 John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

1 John 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

1 John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

My late husband committed suicide with alcohol. He made a "profession" of faith in 1978 but continued on in the same "old" sinful lifestyle until his death in October, 2000. Some people would say he went to heaven because he made that "profession"...I say, and sincerely believe, that my late husband went to hell. I have left the matter in God's hands.

Edited December 21, 2011 by LindaR

[John81]

Matthew 15:18-19 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man. For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:

One commits suicide because it is in one's heart to commit suicide. Suicide is murder and murder defiles.

Revelation 21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

Nothing that defiles will enter God's Kingdom... nothing.

1 Samuel 15:23 For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from being king.

Suicide is an act or rebellion, it is as the sin of witchcraft. Stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Instead of submitting to the leading and guidance of the Holy Spirit, the one who committed suicide stubbornly chose a different method of solving his or her problems.

And God sees their rebellion and stubbornness the same as He sees witchcraft and idolatry.

Suicides are the result of an evil heart, one that knows not God.

All sin begins in the heart and all sin defiles.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

All sin does defile a man, but suicide is a sin that cannot be repented of. Once it's done, it's done.

[JerryNumbers]

Yet, but you forget one small thing, once a person is saved, they're saved for ever, & there is not a single sin that can make a true believe lose their salvation.

So if a saved person commits suicide, it does not send them to hell.

And of course, if a person is not saved, they are already hell bound.

And there's many that feel just like you, but they do not have a leg to stand on, but of course I know you will not understand that. For you have already made up your mind that if anyone commits suicide they go strait to hell. And so far all you have done is use Holy Scriptures out of context to prove what you believe.

And the only reason I have made any more post is for the benefit of those that do not know, hopefully to help them to keep from falling for that which is wrong.

[John81]

All sin does defile a man, but suicide is a sin that cannot be repented of. Once it's done, it's done.

If a Christian dies while committing adultery, telling a lie, stealing or any other sin they can't repent of it but that doesn't mean they were not saved and doesn't send them to hell.

[JerryNumbers]

If a Christian dies while committing adultery, telling a lie, stealing or any other sin they can't repent of it but that doesn't mean they were not saved and doesn't send them to hell.

My wife had a 1st cousin, she was married, got killed in the pickup truck with another man of whom she had been running around with. I actually do not know if she was saved or not. But one thing I do know, if she was saved, even though she was not acting like a saved person at her death, she is not in heaven.

And if she was saved, when judgment day comes, there is no doubt she will lose rewards.

And perhaps she was saved, and perhaps God got tired of her living that way, & for her that was the sin unto death, & God called her home.

Of course I don't know, I'm just basing thoughts on Bible teachings.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

Yet, but you forget one small thing, once a person is saved, they're saved for ever, & there is not a single sin that can make a true believe lose their salvation.

So if a saved person commits suicide, it does not send them to hell.

And of course, if a person is not saved, they are already hell bound.

And there's many that feel just like you, but they do not have a leg to stand on, but of course I know you will not understand that. For you have already made up your mind that if anyone commits suicide they go strait to hell. And so far all you have done is use Holy Scriptures out of context to prove what you believe.

And the only reason I have made any more post is for the benefit of those that do not know, hopefully to help them to keep from falling for that which is wrong.

The teaching that all suicides are going to hell is not wrong, as much as you'd like it to be. Scripture clearly states that all murderers will have their part in the lake of fire.

If one murders ones self, it is impossible for that one to repent of that sin. That person leaves this life a murderer, not a blood washed child of God. That one that has others believing he went to heaven after committed suicide is skillful in the art of deceiving in light of the Word of God. Their evil heart revealed that they were not of God at all.

Of course many can't accept that fact.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

If a Christian dies while committing adultery, telling a lie, stealing or any other sin they can't repent of it but that doesn't mean they were not saved and doesn't send them to hell.

So you're telling me, that a man who makes a profession of faith in Christ, appears to be a Christian, is seen doing things Christians do, if that man 30 years later allows that which is in his heart to surface and he commits a homosexual act and dies in that act, he is still going to heaven?

Really? Edited December 22, 2011 by Standing Firm In Christ

[JerryNumbers]

God's grace is something you seem not able to accept. And every soul that enters heaven will be only by the grace of God.

As previously stated;

1. it will be up to our Lord who enters heaven or not, so its best to leave that up to Him.
2. the only sin that the blood of our Savior will not cover, is unbelief.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

I have already accepted God's Grace.

What I don't accept is the teaching that one can commit suicide and still enter God's Kingdom when His Word clearly teaches that all, (not some) murderers will have their part in the lake of fire.

God's Word already states who will go to the lake of fire, so it's best to believe His Word
The one that commits suicide practices unbelief.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

C.H. Spurgeon, in his sermon "The Sin of Unbelief" delivered on January 14 1855, wrote:

I will attempt this morning, for a little while, to show the extremely evil nature of the sin of unbelief.
1. First the sin of unbelief will appear to be extremely heinous when we remember thatit is the parent of every other iniquity.

There is no crime which unbelief will not produce. I think that the fall of man was surely a result of the sin of unbelief. It was at this point that the devil tempted Eve. He said to her, “Did God really say, ‘You must not eat from any tree in the garden’?” He whispered and insinuated a doubt, “Did God really say?” as much as to say, “Are you quite sure he said that?” It was by means of unbelief--that thin part of the wedge--that the other sin entered; curiosity and the rest followed; she touched the fruit, and destruction came into this world. Since that time, unbelief has been the prolific parent of all guilt. An unbeliever is capable of the vilest crime that ever was committed. Unbelief, friends! Unbelief! why it hardened the heart of Pharaoh--it has given liberty to many blaspheming tongues--yes, it even became a disciple, and murdered Jesus. Unbelief!--it has sharpened the knife of the suicide; it has mixed many a cup of poison; and many to a shameful grave, who have murdered themselves and rushed with bloody hands before their Creator’s tribunal, because of unbelief.
Give me an unbeliever--let me know that he doubts God’s word--let me know that he distrusts his promise and his threats; and with that for a premise, I will conclude that the man will, in time, unless there is amazing restraining power exerted on him, be guilty of the foulest and blackest crimes. Ah! this is a Beelzebub sin; like Beelzebub, it is the leader of all evil spirits. It is said of Jeroboam that he sinned and caused Israel to sin; and it may be said of unbelief that it not only sins itself, but makes others sin; it is the egg of all crime, the seed of every offence; in fact, everything that is evil and vile lies couched in that one word--unbelief.

I truly believe that Spurgeon hit the nail on the head when he said that unbelief "sharpened the knife of suicide," and that "it is the parent of every other iniquity". It is because of unbelief that one commits suicide. Unbelief that Jesus is the answer to man's problems; unbelief that God has provided a way to escape temptation; unbelief that God promises an eternity in torment to those who are guilty of murder. Suicide is murder, and for those who commit it, God's wrath is imminent. Edited December 22, 2011 by Standing Firm In Christ

[2Tim215]

C.H. Spurgeon, in his sermon "The Sin of Unbelief" delivered on January 14 1855, wrote:






I truly believe that Spurgeon hit the nail on the head when he said that unbelief "sharpened the knife of suicide," and that "it is the parent of every other iniquity". It is because of unbelief that one commits suicide. Unbelief that Jesus is the answer to man's problems; unbelief that God has provided a way to escape temptation; unbelief that God promises an eternity in torment to those who are guilty of murder. Suicide is murder, and for those who commit it, God's wrath is imminent.

Like everything you say and do, it's based on your own opinion. When you quote scripture you quote out of context and twist to your own ends. Likewise, now quoting Spurgeon, you failed to continue with his sermon - shame on you for for pushing a lie, for damning all besides yourself.

The rest of the sermon:

It is said of Jeroboam that he sinned and made Israel to sin; and it may be said of unbelief that it not only sins itself, but makes others sin; it is the egg of all crime, the seed of every offence; in fact everything that is evil and vile lies couched in that one word—unbelief.
And let me say here, that unbelief in the Christian is of the self-same nature as unbelief in the sinner. It is not the same in its final issue, for it will be pardoned in the Christian; yea it is pardoned: it was laid upon the scapegoat's head of old: it was blotted out and atoned for; but it is of the same sinful nature. In fact, if there can be one sin more heinous than the unbelief of a sinner, it is the unbelief of a saint. For a saint to doubt God's word—for a saint to distrust God after innumerable instances of his love, after ten thousand proofs of his mercy, exceeds everything. In a saint, moreover, unbelief is the root of other sins. When I am perfect in faith, I shall be perfect in everything else; I should always fulfill the precept if I always believed the promise. But it is because my faith is weak, that I sin. Put me in trouble, and if I can fold my arms and say, "Jehovah-Jireh, the Lord will provide," you will not find me using wrong means to escape from it. But let me be in temporal distress and difficulty; if I distrust God, what then? Perhaps I shall steal, or do a dishonest act to get out of the hands of my creditors; or if kept from such a transgression, I may plunge into excess to drown my anxieties. Once take away faith, the reins are broken; and who can ride an unbroken steed without rein or bridle? Like the chariot of the sun, with Phaeton for its driver, such should we be without faith. Unbelief is the mother of vice; it is the parent of sin; and, therefore, I say it is a pestilent evil—a master sin.

The link to the full sermon for those who wish to read it and make sure I have not misquoted.

http://www.spurgeon.org/sermons/0003.htm

[Standing Firm In Christ]

I did not post the whole sermon because it is too long.

And I did not twist anything. I posted the two paragraphs in their totatity.

But even so, I agree with the two paragraphs that I posted. And Spurgeon was wrong in saying it will be pardoned in the Christian, for the Christian will never commit suicide. If one proclaiming to be a Christian commits suicide, it prove he was not a Christian after all. He only professed and never possessed. Had the Holy Spirit been in him, he would have heard the voice of the Savior and repented of such a thought. Christ's sheep hear His voice and they follow Him.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

Suicide is a result of unbelief that is harbored in the heart. When one commits suicide, he is proving he has not the nature of Christ dwelling in him. For, had he the nature of Christ, no doubt he would not have committed suicide. Rather, he would have trusted God for strength in trials, for steadfastness in temptations, for stamina in testing.

He would not have killed himself.

Suicide is an act of rebellion and rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft.

Isaiah 30:1 Woe to the rebellious children, saith the LORD, that take counsel, but not of me; and that cover with a covering, but not of my spirit, that they may add sin to sin:

The suicidal person does not hear God's counsel. Their suicide is covering sin with sin. In their act, they prove their lost estate.

Edited December 22, 2011 by Standing Firm In Christ