Does Herman Cain support abortion rights?

[JerryNumbers]

Does Herman Cain support abortion rights?

[John81]

Eventually he will have to clarify this but it's very troubling that he hasn't done so already.

If one is truly 100% pro life, then they believe all abortion is murder. Murder is illegal so if all abortion is murder then all abortion should be illegal. That's not difficult to state or stand upon.

[ThePilgrim]

When I attempt to decipher what he said, I think he is pro-life except in certain cases. I think in his own fashion, he said it is none of the governments business and he wouldn't want to impose his beliefs on others. It sounds to me like that is a pro-choice position.

God bless,
Larry

[Guest]

1. Is Herman Cain, as President, responsible for supporting the U.S. Constitution and it's ammendments?

2. Is there any requirement that a sitting president argue for something unacceptable to him?

if the answers above are 1. Yes and 2. No; then in interviews or debates when asked about abortion, I hope the answer would be similar to...

I am a Christian and on the subject of abortion, I am pro life. I believe life begins at conception. I support and commend those who would endeavor to save that life.

If pressed further on some form or part of abortion...

I am a Christian and on the subject of abortion, I am pro life. I believe life begins at conception. I support and commend those who would endeavor to save that child's life.

OR

I believe I've already answered your question.

Edited October 22, 2011 by 1Tim115

[ThePilgrim]

1. Is Herman Cain, as President, responsible for supporting the U.S. Constitution and it's ammendments?

2. Is there any requirement that a sitting president argue for something unacceptable to him?

if the answers above are 1. Yes and 2. No; then in interviews or debates when asked about abortion, I hope the answer would be similar to...

I am a Christian and on the subject of abortion, I am pro life. I believe life begins at conception. I support and commend those who would endeavor to save that life.

If pressed further on some form or part of abortion...

I am a Christian and on the subject of abortion, I am pro life. I believe life begins at conception. I support and commend those who would endeavor to save that child's life.

OR

I believe I've already answered your question.

Actually the answer to both 1 and 2 is yes.
Number 1 a sitting president is required to follow the constitution.
Number 2 a sitting president is required to uphold the constitution whether he agrees with it or not.

Your theoretical politician as you portray his answer is giving a typical politician's answer. It is vague and says nothing except what he believes the particular audience wishes to hear.
His answer "I am a Christian and on the subject of abortion". How does his answer convince me he is a Christian? Am I just to take his word for it with no proof?
His answer "I am pro life. I believe life begins at conception". Is the fact that he believes life begins at conception proof that he is pro-life? I have no doubt in my mind that Satan believes life begins at conception and I don't think anybody would ever accuse him of being pro-life.
His answer " I support and commend those who would endeavor to save that child's life". Of course he would say that. That part of his answer is merely the expected tag line to his other answers.
The politician has not really answered your question.

God bless,
Larry

[swathdiver]

The "right" to murder a child is not in the Constitution. It was pulled from thin air by a bunch of marxists wearing black robes at the Supreme Court.

The 5th Amendment to the Constitution says:

"No person shall be ...deprived of life, liberty, or property"

The Supreme Court has ruled many times before and since Roe-V-Wade that unborn children are human and people and therefore are entitled to the same God-given rights as the rest of us.

When a person wimps out and says they are opposed to abortion personally and don't want the government to interfere, they are accepting the left's agenda of separating people from God through the murder of those least able to defend themselves, a baby in her mother's womb, for purely selfish reasons.

Never accept that premise as it is false and you cannot win an argument from such a position. Of course the only sure-fire way to change the pro-abortion person is with the Gospel.

Not even watching the little ones being torn apart while they attempt to flee the abortionists instruments of death on an ultra-sound is enough to change their darkened hearts. Only Christ can do that. I can't for the life of me understand how I used to hold their position but did until I believed that there was a God and that he made me and therefore I had no right to destroy another one of His creations.

[JerryNumbers]

I would like for the government to stay out of the doctors office, stay out of the hospital room. For when they enter theses two places, they're going to force their view on everyone. And eventually they will rule that person is to old to give medical care, let them die & save money, & or that person is to sick to give medical care, it would coast to much to give them medical care in order that they might live. let them die, that baby, it would cost to much to give him medical care, let him die.

As for, "No person shall be... deprived of life, liberty, or property," that only depend on whose way that person gets in. I recently read of a town using eminent domain to run a man out of his shop that he has operated for many years, for the city claims they must have it.

And I know of a man that was run out of his house because the state wanted to move a road.

No, those freedoms are not guaranteed.

If you, your property, you life, gets in the way of the right one, there is no guarantees, you may lose all of them.

There is only one guarantee that I know of, if a person dies without Christ they will suffer everlasting punishment. OH, there's one more, if a person has Christ as Savior, they will spend eternity in Heaven.

Sorry, I mist stated above, I came up with two guarantees.

[swathdiver]

Jerry, I don't want Barney Frank getting between me and my doctor when FDR has already driven us miles apart. I don't want Chris Dodd between me and my banker either when FDR drove us apart too. However, we need a government to secure these rights to protect the weak and infirm and carry out the Great Commission. Allowing a person to kill their unborn child is not a personal decision between a patient and doctor, it's the murder of those least able to defend themselves.

Eminent Domain has long been abused by Statists to satisfy their belly. We should not have allowed such nonsense to prosper because when given an inch, they run for miles. Brother John says the Heroes of the OT, those who stood up to wicked rulers should not be followed today. Our Founders mentioned them and America was born through Divine Providence IMHO. Since we've let them by apathy or ignorance destroy our public education system this nation has become increasingly hostile to Christians.

Knowing what you know today Jerry, should you sit idly by as the Austrian and East Prussian Christians did during the 1930s allowing Hitler to come to power? How did the Gospel spread during the 1930-50s in East Prussia Jerry?

[HappyChristian]

Yesterday in an interview with Piers Morgan on CNN, I was asked questions about abortion policy and the role of the President. I understood the thrust of the question to ask whether that I, as president, would simply “order” people to not seek an abortion. My answer was focused on the role of the President. The President has no constitutional authority to order any such action by anyone. That was the point I was trying to convey. As to my political policy view on abortion, I am 100% pro-life. End of story.

This is a quote from Cain, regarding the interview mentioned in the OP article. And he is 100% right. It is not in the purview of the POTUS to ban abortion. The problem that we have is that we do not completely understand what a federal republic is. In a federal republic, states are sovereign. The federal government is not to reach into the business of individual states. Roe v. Wade did exactly that. States can nullify it, but there is not a lot of knowledge about that floating around. States can also outlaw abortion. Because of Roe v. Wade, attempts have been thrown out...but if states would step up and nullify, we could have victory. And that is where Christians need to come in...

Herman Cain, as POTUS, cannot decide for individual families whether or not they abort. He has stated that he is pro-life. Ergo, if asked his advice as a friend, he would likely (and I say likely because I can't speak for him, but his being pro-life says so) advise against abortion - but he could not correctly do that as POTUS. That's all he's saying, really.

Yes, we as Christians know abortion is wrong. And we need to elect public servants who are pro-life. That would impact legislation greatly. He is pro-life. And I'm glad.

[John81]

Jerry, I don't want Barney Frank getting between me and my doctor when FDR has already driven us miles apart. I don't want Chris Dodd between me and my banker either when FDR drove us apart too. However, we need a government to secure these rights to protect the weak and infirm and carry out the Great Commission. Allowing a person to kill their unborn child is not a personal decision between a patient and doctor, it's the murder of those least able to defend themselves.

Eminent Domain has long been abused by Statists to satisfy their belly. We should not have allowed such nonsense to prosper because when given an inch, they run for miles. Brother John says the Heroes of the OT, those who stood up to wicked rulers should not be followed today. Our Founders mentioned them and America was born through Divine Providence IMHO. Since we've let them by apathy or ignorance destroy our public education system this nation has become increasingly hostile to Christians.

Knowing what you know today Jerry, should you sit idly by as the Austrian and East Prussian Christians did during the 1930s allowing Hitler to come to power? How did the Gospel spread during the 1930-50s in East Prussia Jerry?

Regarding the first paragraph: Those things are the domain of the State governments. There is no authority in the Constitution for the federal government to be involved in those matters.

Second paragraph: Of course they cited OT folks because the NT teaches against what they wanted to do. Look into the history of many of these men and they were not biblical Christians.

Final paragraph: Christianity tends to flourish under persecution as well as serves to separate the wheat from the tares. Christians are taught by the Holy Ghost through the New Testament to influence change by praying for all in authority (the good, bad and ugly), spreading the Gospel and exampling Christ for others to see. Nero, who was the wicked ruler greatly persecuting Christians during the time when the Holy Ghost inspired Paul and Peter to write about these matters, was far worse than most other wicked leaders and the Christian response to such was the same it is to be for us and all Christians; submission to their authority, praying for them, spreading the Gospel, living as Christ lived. God is able to do far more when we obey Him than we could ever hope to accomplish by doing anything else.

[swathdiver]

Of course they cited OT folks because the NT teaches against what they wanted to do. Look into the history of many of these men and they were not biblical Christians.

Final paragraph: Christianity tends to flourish under persecution as well as serves to separate the wheat from the tares. Christians are taught by the Holy Ghost through the New Testament to influence change by praying for all in authority (the good, bad and ugly), spreading the Gospel and exampling Christ for others to see.

I'm trying John but I just haven't come to the same conclusions you have. Even in the NT people obeyed God rather than rulers when they went against God. Praying for them is one thing, opposing them for the Lord quite another.

I don't see how Christianity flourishes under intense tyranny. There are no churches left in Afghanistan and "Christians" of all stripes are being slaughtered by the Mohammadans throughout Africa and Asia right now. Where is the fruit of the Gospel being spread throughout Soviet Russia today? How about East Prussia today? Adversity and tough times bring many to the Lord, I can personally attest to that. Faith sustained Liane Brown walking miles through mine fields and forests for a couple of peanuts to share her entire family but the Gospel wasn't spread. A Communist recounted how he witnessed hundreds of Christians being tortured and then murdered by the Nazis in silence and complete submission. Reverend Richard Wurmbrand however, brought many Communist and other people to Christ while he was in prison and part of the underground church. Even then, I wouldn't say the Gospel flourished.

The Gospel flourishes with Freedom. The Geneva and then King James put God's Word into the hands of every believer, that's when the Gospel began to flourish. When America won her Independence the prosperity brought to her citizens allowed them to send missions around the world to every corner to spread the Gospel.

[John81]

I'm trying John but I just haven't come to the same conclusions you have. Even in the NT people obeyed God rather than rulers when they went against God. Praying for them is one thing, opposing them for the Lord quite another.

I don't see how Christianity flourishes under intense tyranny. There are no churches left in Afghanistan and "Christians" of all stripes are being slaughtered by the Mohammadans throughout Africa and Asia right now. Where is the fruit of the Gospel being spread throughout Soviet Russia today? How about East Prussia today? Adversity and tough times bring many to the Lord, I can personally attest to that. Faith sustained Liane Brown walking miles through mine fields and forests for a couple of peanuts to share her entire family but the Gospel wasn't spread. A Communist recounted how he witnessed hundreds of Christians being tortured and then murdered by the Nazis in silence and complete submission. Reverend Richard Wurmbrand however, brought many Communist and other people to Christ while he was in prison and part of the underground church. Even then, I wouldn't say the Gospel flourished.

The Gospel flourishes with Freedom. The Geneva and then King James put God's Word into the hands of every believer, that's when the Gospel began to flourish. When America won her Independence the prosperity brought to her citizens allowed them to send missions around the world to every corner to spread the Gospel.

Notice when it comes to a choice between whether to obey a command of God or a command of man, Christians are to obey the command of God, but at the same time be submissive to the authorities over us and accept whatever consequences come from our obedience to God. None of the Apostles rebelled against unjust laws or even against ungodly laws. They simply obeyed God and when the authority over them came to arrest them for obeying God they willingly submitted to their authority, even to the point of death.

Have you ever read of the strong Christians who came out of World War Two, both in the European and Pacific theaters, who had been under heavy hands and great persecution for years?

What about the underground church in China? Consider the great persecution in India where the Gospel is speading mightily.

[swathdiver]

Yes, Mrs. Liane Brown is one of those Christians who survived both the Nazis and Communists during WW2. She has written two books on her experiences. I've read a great many books by people who were in her situation, but hers was the first from the perspective of a Christian. All the others were agnostics or atheists themselves or they didn't mention their faith in God and the role He played throughout their trials as Mrs. Brown did in her books.

Can you recommend some titles?

[John81]

Yes, Mrs. Liane Brown is one of those Christians who survived both the Nazis and Communists during WW2. She has written two books on her experiences. I've read a great many books by people who were in her situation, but hers was the first from the perspective of a Christian. All the others were agnostics or atheists themselves or they didn't mention their faith in God and the role He played throughout their trials as Mrs. Brown did in her books.

Can you recommend some titles?

You haven't even read The Hiding Place?

[Guest]

Actually the answer to both 1 and 2 is yes.
Number 1 a sitting president is required to follow the constitution.
Number 2 a sitting president is required to uphold the constitution whether he agrees with it or not.

Your theoretical politician as you portray his answer is giving a typical politician's answer. It is vague and says nothing except what he believes the particular audience wishes to hear.
His answer "I am a Christian and on the subject of abortion". How does his answer convince me he is a Christian? Am I just to take his word for it with no proof?
His answer "I am pro life. I believe life begins at conception". Is the fact that he believes life begins at conception proof that he is pro-life? I have no doubt in my mind that Satan believes life begins at conception and I don't think anybody would ever accuse him of being pro-life.
His answer " I support and commend those who would endeavor to save that child's life". Of course he would say that. That part of his answer is merely the expected tag line to his other answers.
The politician has not really answered your question.

God bless,
Larry

I'd love to argue with you but, I don't think it would get either of us anywhere. I'll stick to my own but, thanks for the critique.

P.S. I didn't say what the question was. Edited October 26, 2011 by 1Tim115