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Frank Garlock


Jimb

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Any men outside of the Bible I will let God decides whether they've been very usable to God or not.

As for John Wesley I do not use any of his material nor would I recommend anyone attend the church he founded, but I would warn them against it & its false teaching if I was asked..

Jerry, I wouldn't recommend the Methodist Church for anything today either....but today's Methodists are a far cry from what John Wesley founded. However, there is no doubt that God used him. Souls were saved everywhere he preached. He trained up young men to preach, and they did. He was a very important influence on George Whitefield, who came to America, and subsequently brought revival to our Colonies, which in turn spurred on the American War for Independence.
As many people were converted under George Whitefield's preaching, they had nobody to indoctrinate them with Whitefield/Wesley's doctrine, so they just read their Bibles....and lo, and behold, many of them became Baptists. It was such a "problem" to Whitefield that he once lamented, "All my chickens have become ducks" - meaning that they rejected the Anglican infant baptism, and insisted upon Scriptural baptism by immersion after salvation......
So God DID use Wesley and Whitefield to at least get people saved, then reading their Bibles, and then cleaning up society. Wesley's influence was so strong in England that his Methodist movement literally saved England from disaster, while Whitefield's preaching lead to our INdependence.

God will use men outside of our line of doctrine from time to time. The Baptists at that point in history were so reviled and hated that they had no credibility with the general public.
Do I agree with ALL of Wesley's doctrine? No.
But his journal has some excellent material in it, and many of his sermons are "spot on."

To tie this in with the entire Thread, there is no doubt that Frank Garlock has been used to expose rock music for what it is, and also to produce some excellent music.

Jesus said it best: Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
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Jerry, I wouldn't recommend the Methodist Church for anything today either....but today's Methodists are a far cry from what John Wesley founded. However, there is no doubt that God used him. Souls were saved everywhere he preached. He trained up young men to preach, and they did. He was a very important influence on George Whitefield, who came to America, and subsequently brought revival to our Colonies, which in turn spurred on the American War for Independence.
As many people were converted under George Whitefield's preaching, they had nobody to indoctrinate them with Whitefield/Wesley's doctrine, so they just read their Bibles....and lo, and behold, many of them became Baptists. It was such a "problem" to Whitefield that he once lamented, "All my chickens have become ducks" - meaning that they rejected the Anglican infant baptism, and insisted upon Scriptural baptism by immersion after salvation......
So God DID use Wesley and Whitefield to at least get people saved, then reading their Bibles, and then cleaning up society. Wesley's influence was so strong in England that his Methodist movement literally saved England from disaster, while Whitefield's preaching lead to our INdependence.

God will use men outside of our line of doctrine from time to time. The Baptists at that point in history were so reviled and hated that they had no credibility with the general public.
Do I agree with ALL of Wesley's doctrine? No.
But his journal has some excellent material in it, and many of his sermons are "spot on."

To tie this in with the entire Thread, there is no doubt that Frank Garlock has been used to expose rock music for what it is, and also to produce some excellent music.

Jesus said it best: Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

There is so much wrong with this post one would have to write a booklet, or even a book, to correct it all.
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Jerry, I wouldn't recommend the Methodist Church for anything today either....but today's Methodists are a far cry from what John Wesley founded. However, there is no doubt that God used him. Souls were saved everywhere he preached. He trained up young men to preach, and they did. He was a very important influence on George Whitefield, who came to America, and subsequently brought revival to our Colonies, which in turn spurred on the American War for Independence.
As many people were converted under George Whitefield's preaching, they had nobody to indoctrinate them with Whitefield/Wesley's doctrine, so they just read their Bibles....and lo, and behold, many of them became Baptists. It was such a "problem" to Whitefield that he once lamented, "All my chickens have become ducks" - meaning that they rejected the Anglican infant baptism, and insisted upon Scriptural baptism by immersion after salvation......
So God DID use Wesley and Whitefield to at least get people saved, then reading their Bibles, and then cleaning up society. Wesley's influence was so strong in England that his Methodist movement literally saved England from disaster, while Whitefield's preaching lead to our INdependence.

God will use men outside of our line of doctrine from time to time. The Baptists at that point in history were so reviled and hated that they had no credibility with the general public.
Do I agree with ALL of Wesley's doctrine? No.
But his journal has some excellent material in it, and many of his sermons are "spot on."

To tie this in with the entire Thread, there is no doubt that Frank Garlock has been used to expose rock music for what it is, and also to produce some excellent music.

Jesus said it best: Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.


I will let God decided this, not myself, for I cannot read the heart.

As for the Methodist, they have never been right, they were wrong in the beginning, & they're still wrong.

Now, I know a few men personally, that I would state, God seemed to use them, but the men I speak of I have been around personally, Mr Wesley, & Mr. Garlock, I never spent one single moment around them. so I don't know if God used them or not, & I surely will not proclaim they were used greatly by God, I will let God decide that.

Now, I will point you to some men that God has used, just go read Hebrews 11, & believe it, for its in the Bible.

As for Mr. Wesley, he founded a false church that abounded in false teachings, that taught commandments of men for commandments of God.


Mt 15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
Mr 7:7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
Believe the Bible, take what is written outside of it with a grain of salt, & do not procliam it to be truth, nor of God.

Joh 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
Joh 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.



Truth is of the most importance, we have it, within the pages of the Bible, follow that, not people such as Mr. Wesley or Garlock, and if you want to elevate anyone, why not elevate our Father, & His Son, give them all the glory, if you do, you can't go wrong with that, leaving the other in God's hands.
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There is so much wrong with this post one would have to write a booklet, or even a book, to correct it all.

John, everything I said here can be documented. Of course, this is a very brief summary of events, and the affects of Whitefield and Wesley were often felt indirectly. It doesn't change the facts.
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John, everything I said here can be documented. Of course, this is a very brief summary of events, and the affects of Whitefield and Wesley were often felt indirectly. It doesn't change the facts.

The facts are far different than what you have put forth.
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I will let God decided this, not myself, for I cannot read the heart.

As for the Methodist, they have never been right, they were wrong in the beginning, & they're still wrong.

Now, I know a few men personally, that I would state, God seemed to use them, but the men I speak of I have been around personally, Mr Wesley, & Mr. Garlock, I never spent one single moment around them. so I don't know if God used them or not, & I surely will not proclaim they were used greatly by God, I will let God decide that.

Now, I will point you to some men that God has used, just go read Hebrews 11, & believe it, for its in the Bible.

As for Mr. Wesley, he founded a false church that abounded in false teachings, that taught commandments of men for commandments of God.


Mt 15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
Mr 7:7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
Believe the Bible, take what is written outside of it with a grain of salt, & do not procliam it to be truth, nor of God.

Joh 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
Joh 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.



Truth is of the most importance, we have it, within the pages of the Bible, follow that, not people such as Mr. Wesley or Garlock, and if you want to elevate anyone, why not elevate our Father, & His Son, give them all the glory, if you do, you can't go wrong with that, leaving the other in God's hands.

Jerry, we should not determine whether or not God used somebody based solely on whether or not we have personally met them. Many of Wesley's sermons are in print, and can be read and reviewed by us today. We have the historical accounts of his ministry, by which we can judge the merits of his work.
Please do not misunderstand me. I fully acknowledge that he never left off infant baptism and the sacraments of the Anglican church. I am sure there are other points of doctrine upon which I would disagree with Wesley and Whitefield about. But it does not mean that God didn't use them. He most certainly did. Thousands of souls were saved under their preaching. Despite their tenacious hold upon Anglican doctrines, they both preached salvation by grace through faith, sincere repentance, and the need for holy living. I can go along with that, and I fail to see why anyone else would NOT agree with those points.
The thousands of souls saved, and the resultant changed lives are certainly testimony to the work God did for them.

One of the converts that came out of Whitefield's revival campaigns in New England was a man by the name of Shubal Stearns. Mr. Stearns became a baptist, moved to North Carolina, and is largely responsible for what is known today as the Bible Belt......all because an Anglican/Methodist came to the American colonies and preached salvation by grace through faith......

And OF COURSE I recognize that it is GOD doing the work through men.....God uses men to accomplish His will. We don't glorify men, we glorify God. But sometimes God uses men that WE don't approve of, and sometimes that offends our sensibilities. Instead of giving God the Glory for what God did through an "unapproved" man like Wesley, I find too many people refusing to acknowledge God's use of the "unapproved man" by saying we should not talk about men but God only......To me, that's a cop-out.

Three verses:
Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
AH-HA!!! So we CAN know if God used somebody!!!

Lu 9:49 And John answered and said, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name; and we forbad him, because he followeth not with us.
Lu 9:50 And Jesus said unto him, Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us.
OH, I see! This question is nothing new! The Disciples themselves fell into this trap of condemning someone that God was using!
Wesley may not have been "one of us" but he certainly was not AGAINST us. He had the same broad goals that we do - preaching salvation to the lost.

Luke 11:23 He that is not with me is against me: and he that gathereth not with me scattereth.
So when somebody opposes the work of God, then we should avoid them.

Again, I don't endorse EVERYTHING Wesley did and said. But it is quite obvious that God DID use him in a miraculous way, and particularly without our approval.....just like God used Hudson Taylor, D.L. Moody, and Billy Sunday without our approval....God still gets the Glory no matter how the work gets done.

The most important fruit that came out of Whitefield's revival campaigns was the growth of the Baptists. Whitefield's preaching produced so many converts in the dead Congregationalist churches that these converts split over Baptism, and started their own churches. It spread all throughout the colonies. The Baptist growth in Virginia led to the Virginia establishment of religious liberty, which in turn led to our First Amendment rights.....all because God sent a Methodist/Anglican preacher over to America to preach the gospel.

One final note: I hope you don't take this personally, because I generally agree with your posts! Edited by Steve Schwenke
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It was George Whitfield who introduced Wesley to open air preaching. They later fell out as Wesley was an arminian and Whitfield was a Calvinist. I believe that after many years they were reconciled to each other.

Neither was a Methodist as the Methodists separated from the CofE after Wesley's death. Wesley founded Methodist Clubs. Wesley believed in sinless perfection.

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Jerry, we should not determine whether or not God used somebody based solely on whether or not we have personally met them. Many of Wesley's sermons are in print, and can be read and reviewed by us today. We have the historical accounts of his ministry, by which we can judge the merits of his work.
Please do not misunderstand me. I fully acknowledge that he never left off infant baptism and the sacraments of the Anglican church. I am sure there are other points of doctrine upon which I would disagree with Wesley and Whitefield about. But it does not mean that God didn't use them. He most certainly did. Thousands of souls were saved under their preaching. Despite their tenacious hold upon Anglican doctrines, they both preached salvation by grace through faith, sincere repentance, and the need for holy living. I can go along with that, and I fail to see why anyone else would NOT agree with those points.
The thousands of souls saved, and the resultant changed lives are certainly testimony to the work God did for them.

One of the converts that came out of Whitefield's revival campaigns in New England was a man by the name of Shubal Stearns. Mr. Stearns became a baptist, moved to North Carolina, and is largely responsible for what is known today as the Bible Belt......all because an Anglican/Methodist came to the American colonies and preached salvation by grace through faith......

And OF COURSE I recognize that it is GOD doing the work through men.....God uses men to accomplish His will. We don't glorify men, we glorify God. But sometimes God uses men that WE don't approve of, and sometimes that offends our sensibilities. Instead of giving God the Glory for what God did through an "unapproved" man like Wesley, I find too many people refusing to acknowledge God's use of the "unapproved man" by saying we should not talk about men but God only......To me, that's a cop-out.

Three verses:
Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
AH-HA!!! So we CAN know if God used somebody!!!

Lu 9:49 And John answered and said, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name; and we forbad him, because he followeth not with us.
Lu 9:50 And Jesus said unto him, Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us.
OH, I see! This question is nothing new! The Disciples themselves fell into this trap of condemning someone that God was using!
Wesley may not have been "one of us" but he certainly was not AGAINST us. He had the same broad goals that we do - preaching salvation to the lost.

Luke 11:23 He that is not with me is against me: and he that gathereth not with me scattereth.
So when somebody opposes the work of God, then we should avoid them.

Again, I don't endorse EVERYTHING Wesley did and said. But it is quite obvious that God DID use him in a miraculous way, and particularly without our approval.....just like God used Hudson Taylor, D.L. Moody, and Billy Sunday without our approval....God still gets the Glory no matter how the work gets done.

The most important fruit that came out of Whitefield's revival campaigns was the growth of the Baptists. Whitefield's preaching produced so many converts in the dead Congregationalist churches that these converts split over Baptism, and started their own churches. It spread all throughout the colonies. The Baptist growth in Virginia led to the Virginia establishment of religious liberty, which in turn led to our First Amendment rights.....all because God sent a Methodist/Anglican preacher over to America to preach the gospel.

One final note: I hope you don't take this personally, because I generally agree with your posts!


The man your holding up started his own brand of a church, the one Jesus founded was not good enough for him, & he also filled it with false teachings. Its easy to know it was filled with false teachings, just check it against the teachings frond in the Bible.
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I'm happy to see there isn't any self righteousness in this thread.


Checking what the Bible teaches, against what a man teaches, is not self righteousness, its known as dividing the truth, & God tells us to study the Bible so that we can divide the truth and not be ashamed. When we can divide the truth, & accept false teaching, that is shame on us. Why?

2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
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The man your holding up started his own brand of a church, the one Jesus founded was not good enough for him, & he also filled it with false teachings. Its easy to know it was filled with false teachings, just check it against the teachings frond in the Bible.



Checking what the Bible teaches, against what a man teaches, is not self righteousness, its known as dividing the truth, & God tells us to study the Bible so that we can divide the truth and not be ashamed. When we can divide the truth, & accept false teaching, that is shame on us. Why?

2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
.

Hmm...
God used Abraham and Issacc both liars, Moses a murderer, and Paul the Apostle...

1 Timothy 1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief. Edited by 1Tim115
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.

Hmm...
God used Abraham and Issacc both liars, Moses a murderer, and Paul the Apostle...

1 Timothy 1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.


Here is some study helps on knowing about the churches Jesus started. If you will go though them studying, along with the use of your Bible, them you can tell what kind of church that man started, & know he ignore Jesus' Churches in order to found his own brand of churches.
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Here is some study helpson knowing about the churches Jesus started. If you will go though them studying, along with the use of your Bible, them you can tell what kind of church that man started, & know he ignore Jesus' Churches in order to found his own brand of churches.


Hey Jerry, thanks! But, I'll let you study them and then you can report back on anything you learn. I've got too much study of God's word backed up and it would be way down the list for me.
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The man your holding up started his own brand of a church, the one Jesus founded was not good enough for him, & he also filled it with false teachings. Its easy to know it was filled with false teachings, just check it against the teachings frond in the Bible.


Jerry, you are mistaking my intentions here. I am using Wesley as an illustration. The OP asks us about Frank Garlock, and if God is using him.....I say "YES" and you say "I don't know because I have never met him."
My point about Wesley is this: God may use people that WE wouldn't - and that is HIS perogative... not ours. I am fully aware of the doctrinal points that we would differ with Wesley on....but I didn't see any BAPTISTS preaching and having such a great impact during that same period of time....they opened the doors for the Baptists to play a vital role in the saving of England, world missions, and American Independence.
So I am not "holding him up" as any kind of man to be worshipped, idolized, etc. We can learn lessons from Wesley (some good lessons and some bad lessons), and God will use any man who preaches the right gospel from the right Bible. Wesley did...even though he was screwed up on other issues.
God used J. Hudson Taylor to open the doors to the interior of China....Baptists didn't get on board that train until he was well into his ministry there.
God used the Congregationalist Jonathan Edwards to preach one of the greatest sermons of all time: Sinners in the hands of an angry God.
God used the Cogregationalist Billy Sunday to help bring in Prohibition.

I am NOT endorsing these men, their doctrine, their practices, or their ecclesiology. I am merely stating the facts as they are.

Remember Phil. 1:12-18??? Is not our Saviour honored, glorified, and pleased when a man preaches salvation, and souls are saved?
And isn't God honored, glorified, and pleased when a man gives us proper instruction on Biblical music, and then even gives us more Scripturally-based music for our edification?

Frank Garlock may not be 100% correct on every iota he teaches about music - but he is Baptist, he is teaching the truth, and he is teaching what the Scriptures say correctly. How could God NOT be pleased with that?
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