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Really dumb. :-S


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So I was dumb, and decided to hop in on an IFB-bashing thread on Facebook on a friend's page, although several of the "discuss-ees" were not my friends although I knew who they were. These people were completely bashing IFB, as a whole, no exceptions. (Basically stemming from that 20/20 report thing.) So while I don't really like to be called a "Fundamentalist" I know that our church is still considered "IFB" (Emphasis on the "I" for Independent!!!) and I was getting sick of these girls bashing pastors and churches. So I got on there and started saying my opinion, in what I thought was a factual way. Well one of the girls is a wicked woman who also posts over on the FFF and within 15 minutes she had posted our church picture, my picture, and a copy of our conversation on her blog as well as her Facebook page. And now there are some pretty mean comments against me and our church on her blog page too. It happened so fast I didn't even have time to block her (which I did now, but its too late) or secure my church webpage or anything.

How can alleged Christians be so nasty? She is almost being as nasty as she accuses the IFB group to be. What an awful person!!!!! *Sigh*

Anybody know a free Christian lawyer I can get to send her an email asking her to remove her libelous blog post against my church?

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Wow. I don't know if you could get a libelous charge to stick - if your church is on the web, it's pretty much in the public domain.

I don't know who you're talking about, but I know at least one of my friends on FB had a couple of posts that were anti-IFB as a direct result of the 20/20 show. The shame of things is that the baby is being thrown out with the bathwater in this issue. If a church claims to be IFB, they are wicked, no matter what their philosophy of ministry is (and let's face it, as you said the emphasis is on independent - independent means churches will be different). This friend has a legitimate beef: she was member in a church where the pastor was a sexual predator. Many young ladies were hurt. But...all pastors are not like that, and to generalize like that is wrong.

Hate seems to be the order of the day for much of Christianity. And we wonder why the world laughs!

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Wow. I don't know if you could get a libelous charge to stick - if your church is on the web, it's pretty much in the public domain.

I don't know who you're talking about, but I know at least one of my friends on FB had a couple of posts that were anti-IFB as a direct result of the 20/20 show. The shame of things is that the baby is being thrown out with the bathwater in this issue. If a church claims to be IFB, they are wicked, no matter what their philosophy of ministry is (and let's face it, as you said the emphasis is on independent - independent means churches will be different). This friend has a legitimate beef: she was member in a church where the pastor was a sexual predator. Many young ladies were hurt. But...all pastors are not like that, and to generalize like that is wrong.

Hate seems to be the order of the day for much of Christianity. And we wonder why the world laughs!


You may be joint friends with this person...if so, there is a video with a lot of postings underneath it. If the person did not delete it, then you can probably find my posts and the angry girls fighting...I really should no be ashamed that the one lady posted my stuff on her blog because I said nothing wrong, was simply stressing that we are Independent...they were saying if my husband wanted to prove he is not a perverted pastor he should be denouncing all these people from the pulpit. I simply said that we don't know some of these people and our people do not know them and as we are independent, there is no reason to need to do that, nor be told we need to do that by some women online. We need to focus on teaching the Bible...and I stated that in forming an anti-IFB hate brigade as a hobby horse, some of these people are becoming just as bad as the pastors who preach hobby horses against women or any of their other grievances.

But of course they are twisting my words saying I'm an uncaring person whose fault it is that this stuff goes on. Whatever!
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I wanted to add that I, too, know pastors who are sick and wrong....I know some of the mainstream ones, and I also know a few who nobody else knows about.... I know somebody who preached questionable things and is still in the ministry....but it doesn't mean I have to go in public and start blasting any and all Baptist pastors.

My husband says these people will answer to God for the angry hateful way they are treating innocent pastors and Christians who are serving God in the right way.

Its a shame that we as a group tend to hate our own. Unless part of the group isn't really saved, which simplifies things, I guses.

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There is a video on one of her posts, but nothing by you, so it's probably someone connected with her that I haven't friended. Although the responses aren't vitriolic, they are almost all negative. One fella pointed out that it's that church's business (unless it becomes a crime), which is true and why we are independent.

The thing I find amusing is that they blame IFB churches/schools saying they are so this or that...and yet...I attended a Christian school that wasn't IFB when I was younger, and let me tell you, I could tell some horror stories (it was inter-denominational). And then, in jr. high, I attended a regular baptist school...and there were problems there, too. Too many people seem to forge that human beings are in charge of schools and churches, so whether or not there is sin is not from the label: it's from the fact that the humans gave in to the flesh. And bashing those who don't outright agree with them and hate with them is humans giving in to the flesh, too!

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Suzy, Perhaps this is the key, alleged Christian.

I think its more about hateing Jesus than hating us. And the stronger we stand, the more hate that will be shown towards us.

Yet the main thing is, with those type people you hardly ever win posting to them on the internet, they have no standards, scruples, they never play fair.

I just read the 20/20 piece, not surprised that it caused a big stir.

I might add, I remember reading an article over a year ago written by that Saddleback pastor, he stated the most dangerous people in this world is the Fundamental Islam's and the Fundamental Christians.

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Suzy, Perhaps this is the key, alleged Christian.

I think its more about hateing Jesus than hating us. And the stronger we stand, the more hate that will be shown towards us.

Yet the main thing is, with those type people you hardly ever win posting to them on the internet, they have no standards, scruples, they never play fair.

I just read the 20/20 piece, not surprised that it caused a big stir.

I might add, I remember reading an article over a year ago written by that Saddleback pastor, he stated the most dangerous people in this world is the Fundamental Islam's and the Fundamental Christians.

So true Jerry. It's a sad fact that many professing Christians don't follow the Jesus of Scripture but rather a man-made version of Jesus.
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Well, same thing happened to me. I posted Way of Life's rebuttal to the 20/20 thing on my facebook. I have since deleted all of it. It was not exactly stated but one of the critics said that there was a key doctrine the IFB's teach which causes a breeding ground for abuse. The only doctrine I could think of was separation, which is one of the main doctrines that churches have thrown out the window. Maybe they akin that to isolation? Or maybe it was something about pastoral authority? Or maybe the "independent " thing made them think we weren't accountable enough? I really wasn't sure what the comment on my wall was referring to, but the critic stated that they and some of their friends have experienced great pain and personally know of very similar circumstances in other IFB churches they used to attend. I have heard over and over bashing from Christian friends and family who are in more liberal churches now. They say that a good portion of their memberships are ex-Baptists. And yes, they have stereotyped us IFB's. In their view, we are judgmental, legalistic, unloving, and miserable in our Pharisaical convictions. No matter what scripture I bring out to support certain convictions that are contrary to theirs, the "don't judge" card is thrown at me as well as the "lack of love" card. I fear that there truly are IFB's who have done damage, and there is no excuse for that. I have known the harshest IFB's who later turned out to be either unsaved or the fell into deep sin.
Those of us who truly want to live holy and godly in this present world, love sinners, serve the Lord Jesus Christ, and avoid the worldly entanglements are tagged and labeled. Jesus said "Marvel not that the world hate you" Yet, these are Christians who are siding with the world in their criticism.

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Well the weirdest thing happened...I really prayed that God would somehow remove the nasty posting....or take down her blog...or that somebody would get her to remove the post.

The very next day, the blog was down!!!! Error messages. Then later, it went back up, but the posting about me and my church was gone (not sure if it was because of the problems or because someone convinced her to take it down, either way, I was thankful).

Today the blog is back to down.... whatever is going on, it makes me relieved and happy!

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Well, same thing happened to me. I posted Way of Life's rebuttal to the 20/20 thing on my facebook. I have since deleted all of it. It was not exactly stated but one of the critics said that there was a key doctrine the IFB's teach which causes a breeding ground for abuse. The only doctrine I could think of was separation, which is one of the main doctrines that churches have thrown out the window. Maybe they akin that to isolation? Or maybe it was something about pastoral authority? Or maybe the "independent " thing made them think we weren't accountable enough? I really wasn't sure what the comment on my wall was referring to, but the critic stated that they and some of their friends have experienced great pain and personally know of very similar circumstances in other IFB churches they used to attend. I have heard over and over bashing from Christian friends and family who are in more liberal churches now. They say that a good portion of their memberships are ex-Baptists. And yes, they have stereotyped us IFB's. In their view, we are judgmental, legalistic, unloving, and miserable in our Pharisaical convictions. No matter what scripture I bring out to support certain convictions that are contrary to theirs, the "don't judge" card is thrown at me as well as the "lack of love" card. I fear that there truly are IFB's who have done damage, and there is no excuse for that. I have known the harshest IFB's who later turned out to be either unsaved or the fell into deep sin.
Those of us who truly want to live holy and godly in this present world, love sinners, serve the Lord Jesus Christ, and avoid the worldly entanglements are tagged and labeled. Jesus said "Marvel not that the world hate you" Yet, these are Christians who are siding with the world in their criticism.

It's interesting that, when those who criticize the IFB as a whole, use the term "key doctrine," yet they rarely ever specify!

Standards are many times a major issue for those who were IFB and left their independent Baptist church. One of the problems with many IFB churches (not all, because the churches are independent, no matter what anyone tries to say about the "network" of them) is that standards are taught and preached without any holiness backing them. Standards are important. principles of dress, conduct, morality, ethics, etc., are throughout scripture and so must be part of the Christian walk. However, for so many years, standards have been the way in which people show what they believe that it has become all they believe...and they are not internally what they should be: ergo, true Pharisees (look good on the outside, rotten on the inside). Many young people have fallen by the wayside because they have not been taught to be truly holy, but to look holy instead.

Then there is pastoral authority. Many balk at it, even though it is in scripture. But there are many who go overboard with it. The pastor is the head of his home only, and cannot order the other homes in his flock. He is to preach the whole counsel of God, and the Holy Spirit will convict and change people, and direct the man of the house to lead his family the way God would have him to. But many in the IFB have come to look on their pastor in much the same way that Catholics look on their priests: as the one and only guide in their lives. And so those who have been taught to be man-followers fall by the wayside...

The plain fact of the matter is that every religious belief has its authority abusers. Catholics have priests who seduce women, girls and boys. Pentecostals have women preachers who really meddle in the home life of their congregants (oh, don't get me started on the women preachers associated with my family....), Presbyterians who have sexually abused children (but the Presbyterian who has an all-out attack going on IFB won't admit that happens...), etc., etc. Humans populate all the religious beliefs (I'm sure that's a shock to all! :lol: ), and as such are prone to make mistakes. And sin. And that is the reason that we need to rightly divide the Word of God - know it, love it, obey it. Then no man (or woman) can lead us off the right path.

Those who claim that we aren't to judge don't understand what judging is. They believe that anyone who says a sin is sin is judging them (when, in actuality, it is probably their own guilty conscience). But the Bible tells us to judge righteous judgment. We are to call a spade a spade, and a sin a sin. Glossing over it helps no-one. But!!!! Jesus told His disciples to be wise as serpents, harmless as doves. Christians today would benefit from that advice as well.
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I agree! Too many IFB churches have turned things into practically a "works" type of salvation...work, work, do, do, have this standard, that standard.... standards should come out of a heart for God, and they ARE in the Bible...but not as a source for judging others but as a source to live for God.

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Joh 15:18 If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you.

1Jo 3:13 Marvel not, my brethren, if the world hate you.

This means they hate you even though you've done no wrong, and of course we know that Jesus was falsely accused yet was totally innocent.

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