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    • By 1Timothy115 in Devotionals
         11
      Psalms 119:1-8                                         Sep. 5 - Oct. 2, 2019
      1 ALEPH. Blessed are the undefiled in the way, who walk in the law of the LORD.
      2 Blessed are they that keep his testimonies, and that seek him with the whole heart.
      3 They also do no iniquity: they walk in his ways.
      4 Thou hast commanded us to keep thy precepts diligently.
      5 O that my ways were directed to keep thy statutes!
      6 Then shall I not be ashamed, when I have respect unto all thy commandments.
      7 I will praise thee with uprightness of heart, when I shall have learned thy righteous judgments.
      8 I will keep thy statutes: O forsake me not utterly.
      The following verse stood out to me...
      5 O that my ways were directed to keep thy statutes!
      At first glance it seemed to me this person’s soul is poured out with intense desire to have God’s direction in keeping His Word.
      I made a small wood fire in our backyard for my granddaughter, Julia, since she would be staying overnight with us. My wife and Julia stayed outside at the fire for about half an hour. Then, I found myself alone to watch the fire die out on a particularly lovely evening. So I took my verse from above and began to repeat it for memorization. As I repeated the verse, I tried to contemplate the words and apply them to what I was seeing around me. 
      The moon and stars were out now peering through the scattered clouds above.
      [Genesis 1:16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. Genesis 1:17 And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth, Genesis 1:18 And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.]
      Thought 1         
      The moon has stayed his course since the day God created him, also the stars, obeying the statutes directed by God from the first day they were created. Can you imagine God’s direction to the Moon and stars, “moon you will have a path through the sky above the earth, stars you will occupy the firmament above the moon and be clearly visible in the cloudless night sky.”
      Then, the trees, grass, even the air we breathe obey the statues God gave them from the beginning. None of these creations have souls, none have hearts, none have intelligence, but they all observe God’s statutes, His instructions for their limited time on earth.
      Thought 2
      What if we were like the moon, stars, trees, grass, or the other creations which have no soul? We would be directed to keep God’s statutes without choosing to keep them. This is not the image of God, there would be no dominion over other creatures, or over the earth. We would not be capable of experiencing the joy and peace of learning the love of God
      Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
      Philippians 4:7 And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.
      Thought 3 (October 2, 2019)
      Is the psalmist pleading God to force God’s statutes to become the man’s ways? No, he is speaking of his own failure in keeping God’s statutes and his desire to keep them, very much like Paul in Romans 7:14-25.
      God doesn’t work through force to turn men from their ways that they would desire His statutes or desire God Himself. Men must reject (repent) put aside his own ways and voluntarily seek God and His statutes.

Pastoral Qualifications

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Moses was not fit to lead Israel simply because he got mad and hit the rock instead of speaking to it. I suppose many they be that thinks it was foolish of God to disqualify Moses from leading Israel into the promise land even taking his life for what we would call a very minor disobedience.


The difference, brother, is that Moses sinned and did something wrong in that instance. If Matthew 5 and I Cor. 7 teach that one can biblically be divorces without having sinned, then there is no blame to assign.
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The difference, brother, is that Moses sinned and did something wrong in that instance. If Matthew 5 and I Cor. 7 teach that one can biblically be divorces without having sinned, then there is no blame to assign.


Again, Rick, each man is the head of his home. And the responsibility for the spiritual health for that home lies on that man's shoulders. While we all give account for our own individual lives, husbands will give account for how they husbanded their homes. When there is divorce, the home wasn't properly husbanded (cultivated). Ergo, there is blame to assign to the man...
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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

1Co 7:10 ¶ And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband:
1Co 7:11 But and if she depart, let her remain unmarried, or be reconciled to her husband: and let not the husband put away his wife.

Ro 7:3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.


The divorced person is free to remarry only at the death of their spouse.

1Jo 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

And the Lords way is not grievous to His children.
Remember, God never contradicts Himself.

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Again, Rick, each man is the head of his home. And the responsibility for the spiritual health for that home lies on that man's shoulders. While we all give account for our own individual lives, husbands will give account for how they husbanded their homes. When there is divorce, the home wasn't properly husbanded (cultivated). Ergo, there is blame to assign to the man...


So that means in every case where there is divorce the man is de facto at fault and has sinned? Then why didn't Jesus say that?
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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

1Co 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.

Most men hate the responsibility God has placed them in, and few will act responsible, when things go wrong they try to place the blame somewhere else, just as Adam, yet God did not accept his excuse, notice,Adam even blamed God.


Ge 3:12 And the man said, The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

That doesn't mean that divorced people cannot serve in ministry, including preaching and missions. But I believe that any divorce (whether his own or his marriage to a divorced woman) disqualifies a man from the pastorate.

I find that attitude interesting. It's ok for a "missionary" to be a divorced guy, but not a "pastor". Or perhaps you meant, go on mission trips?
I am a "missionary" (what the Bible calls an evangelist) and I find that too many have the idea that a missionary is somehow lacking pastoral authority or is somehow "less qualified" to pastor.

There is absolutely no Biblical references that default a missionary to a "less than" pastor.

The 4 churches I have planted are full of people that call/called me "pastor".

Wanna know why they call/called me that? Because I am a pastor. Every bit as much as any other pastor you care to name.

my 2 cents.

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If a person is a missionary, they're not a pastor, of course a pastor could become a missionary. And a missionary could become a pastor if qualified. And of course a person can be an evangelist and not be a pastor nor a missionary.

Its not an attitude, its what the Bible teaches. I find it interesting the attitude some, even many, have when they disagree with someone, many times they will say that person has an attitude. Yet perhaps its an attitude within ones self that makes them think the person they disagree with has an attitude.

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I'd agree that a missionary is similar to a pastor and would have to meet the qualifications to be a pastor. It's really common sense. Being a missionary means you have to do the role of a pastor, for awhile at least, until you can get someone else plugged into that spot. That could take years, and I know of cases where a missionary has been the pastor in the same church overseas his entire ministry.

One thing I've seen over and over again is that these qualifications are spoken of for a pastor only. It has much bigger implications than that, it's also for a deacon. If what Jerry and company are saying is true, a man could get divorced before he's saved and he'd be banned from ever being a deacon for the rest of his saved life regardless of whatever fruit God may have worked in his life decades down the road.

If a pastor, missionary, and a deacon are permanently disqualified because of a pre-conversion divorce, then I don't see why an evangelist wouldn't be either.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

The qualifications for pastor is to be the husband of one wife, there are only so many ways that a man can fit that qualification.

1. Have been married one time, never divorced.
2. Are to have been married and wife died, in that case he is free to be married.

Human reasoning and logic is the wrong path to take if you want to follow God. God does not state, if a person married before they were saved, them got a divorce, that is OK. He only states the husband of one wife, nothing added to it as you do by using that IF. Besides that, if what you say is true them God contradicts Himself.

1Ti 3:2 "A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife..."

Tit 1:6 "If any be blameless, the husband of one wife..." And it appears God felt strongly enough about that qualification to have inspired it to be written not once, but twice in two different chapters.

All we can do with that is trust and obey, not look for loopholes as lawyers do. When loopholes are applied we stop trusting and obeying.

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And all the feminists said, "Amen!"

#1 - I'm not a feminist by any stretch of the imagination, Wilch, so let's not go there, okay?
#2 - Rick, does the responsibility for the home rest on the husband or not? (as I said, that doesn't take accountability away from the woman). Note that I didn't say that the man was de facto at fault. But I did say there was blame to assign to the man (in response to your usage of the term). Um, isn't that the essence of leadership?
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Yes, of course the responsibility of the home lies on the husband. That doesn't mean he's at fault or has sinned in every divorce situation though, like you said, his leadership doesn't take away the woman's accountability. I don't think you're a feminist, and I don't think Wilch does either. :)

Obviously if a man is going through divorce proceedings his house is not in order and should step down and do whatever he can to save his marriage. I think we'd all agree on that.

Where my disagreement is the idea of permanent disqualification; specifically the "living wives" interpretation. I wish folks who subscribe to that idea would just admit, if nothing else, that it is an interpretation of a verse that could go one of two ways instead of slamming their fists down and being so dogmatic about something that the Bible doesn't spell out exactly the way they say it does. There's just too many problems with it.

In the end, people pick who they want to be their pastor and deacons, and I've seen God use plenty of pastors and deacons that have a divorce in their past.

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But where is scripture that states re-qualification? Yep, we are forgiven for sins. But as has been said, sins have consequences - some sins leave bigger scars. Divorce is one of those.

Marriage is a picture of Christ and the church...divorce destroys that picture. Even if a Christian backslides, Christ doesn't divorce us. Salvation is permanent.

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So you believe a person is disqualified from being a deacon for his entire life if he was divorced ten years before he was saved?


I have to admit that the before salvation issue is questionable. But one thing I do know: once a person has gotten a divorce, it is easier to do so again. It is always on the table in the subconscious. And I do know of men who were divorced before salvation, got saved, and became preachers....and went on to be divorced and remarried again...and continued preaching. Without remorse.
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Yes, of course the responsibility of the home lies on the husband. That doesn't mean he's at fault or has sinned in every divorce situation though, like you said, his leadership doesn't take away the woman's accountability. I don't think you're a feminist, and I don't think Wilch does either. :)

Obviously if a man is going through divorce proceedings his house is not in order and should step down and do whatever he can to save his marriage. I think we'd all agree on that.

Where my disagreement is the idea of permanent disqualification; specifically the "living wives" interpretation. I wish folks who subscribe to that idea would just admit, if nothing else, that it is an interpretation of a verse that could go one of two ways instead of slamming their fists down and being so dogmatic about something that the Bible doesn't spell out exactly the way they say it does. There's just too many problems with it.

In the end, people pick who they want to be their pastor and deacons, and I've seen God use plenty of pastors and deacons that have a divorce in their past.


No, its not just an interpretation, its what two verses within the Holy Bible says, and that is all that counts, it cannot go any other way except by changing the Bible. This is qualifications to be a pastor of Jesus' New Testament Churches, not for being a Christian.
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Rick,

Based on the qualifications in 1 Tim. 3, yes he is disqualified. I would state that he is qualified again once his 1st wife dies as he is again the husband of one wife.

This conversation started with the Pastor's wife, but apparently has moved to the pastor.

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Does anyone here think it's a little odd that Paul could be a torturer of Christians before he was saved, as in the self-confessed "chief of sinners" who forced people to reject Christ under threats of only God knows what - but he could still be eligible for the role of a deacon after salvation... because he never had a divorce?

Unless, of course, Paul was eligible to write half of the New Testament but not be a deacon.

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