Contemprary Worship in Baptist Churches!

[no name joe]

No, they take a perfectly good hymn and ruin it showing off their singing skills.

If they want to sing songs in such a manner, write their own songs, do not chop someone else's songs to pieces.

But with many of the hymns, the words were written by one person, and they were placed to a tune years later. One example is Amazing Grace. The words were written by John Newton in the late 1700's, and the tune we know was added later around 1835. I see no problem in one using his or her gifts or abilities to write new music, take an old tune and put new words to it, or to take old words and put a new tune to it. I do not think it is fair or right to across the board say it is wrong and people do it for show. Some do, sure. Many do not. I believe it is a sin not to use one's gifts and talents to glorify God, and to put someone down for doing so is not right.


I can agree with you that in some places, people perform in church instead of lead in worship. I agree that is not right. However, I cannot in any way agree with your proposition that across the board, using one's talents as a songwriter to bring glory to God is wrong simply because they may write a new arrangment or tune to accompany words.

Another example is Joyful, Joyful, We Adore Thee. This words were written in the early 1900's by Henry van Dyke. However, he did not write the music, he wrote it to the Ode to Joy tune written centuries earlier. He was using his God given gift of witing beautiful poetry, and using old music to accompany it to build up and edify the church and to bring glory to God.

People who are gifted at writing lyrics and music have a way of using their talents in a way that really can draw people into worship. From King David in the Psalms, to artists today who continue to write wonderful lyrics and music. I just cannot fathom why anyone would degrade that work. I absolutely love watching people at my church worship and particiipating in that worship as we sing from our hearts and lift our hands and hearts to our Creator and Redeemer. Music that leads us to a place of true worship is a gift from God, and a gift to God, whether that music and lyrics are centuries old, or were written last week.

Using your line of logic, I could say that all preachers that are dynmaic and deliver a message from the pulpit that stirs the hearts and minds of people do it to glorify themselves and have no place in the church. Music and preaching have a way to reach the hearts and minds of people. Yes, some people will take that to bring glory to themselves, but most people I have met and know that lead worship and preach have true hearts wanting to glorify and honor God. Edited December 7, 2010 by kindofblue1977

[JerryNumbers]

Yes, such things should not take place, especially inside a church. The songs should be sung for the glory of God. The one singing shouldn't turn into a "performer" putting on a show. Unfortunately, many churches go for this these days. Pentacostal churches and many black churches are really big on this. One of the quickest ways to "become somebody" in the church is to be able to put on a good singing performance. Those who do become celebrities within that church and sometimes go on to become celebrities among similar churches as they "tour" from church to church performing.

In these cases, the attention, focus and praise is upon the performer.

All of the shouting for the performer and wild clapping for their great show is inappropriate in a church.

Yes, and some of those who are in singing so much, if there was no singing, they would not be in church, for they're not in church for Jesus alone, but for the glory they get out of doing what they call performing.

Of course, for many churches, that's what its all about.

[John81]

Yes, and some of those who are in singing so much, if there was no singing, they would not be in church, for they're not in church for Jesus alone, but for the glory they get out of doing what they call performing.

Of course, for many churches, that's what its all about.

We have some of those entertainment churches in this area. One in particular is nearly all entertainment based, with rockin' music in each service. They don't even have a local pastor, but rather they show a short video of some pastor from somewhere else in between all the music. This church opened it's doors a few years ago by having a block party in front of the church. This featured a carnival, live bands, games and assorted other "fun" things.

[1John2:15-17]

We have some of those entertainment churches in this area. One in particular is nearly all entertainment based, with rockin' music in each service. They don't even have a local pastor, but rather they show a short video of some pastor from somewhere else in between all the music. This church opened it's doors a few years ago by having a block party in front of the church. This featured a carnival, live bands, games and assorted other "fun" things.

[Suzy Q]

Music is not the main thrust of a church service, but it should definitely be conducive to making the heart ready for the sermon that will be preached. Contemporary music is NOT going to do that.....it is merely a 'worldly' - feel good type of thing. In our church, we have nothing but the traditional hymns for our services. Since I am the pianist, all of my offertory selections are geared toward giving the preacher ample time to pray before entering the pulpit, and when I play - I am playing to and for the Lord, not the people. All we can do is provide a service with the best possible music program we can, and I'm sorry if this offends anyone but there is NO place for all the garbage that is labelled music nowadays in church. Can you really see our Saviour dancing a jig to most of the stuff being played in even Baptist churches????? I think not.
Praise His Name - I'll continue to play the piano for the Master.....and play for my daughter to sing special music - she sings what people now call 'vintage' music - but when it brings tears to people in the congregation, the Holy Spirit must be using those 'old' favorites to touch their hearts.... :thumb:

[BlessedChristianlady8]

I been attending another church for about a year now that is still baptist but they have mixed hymns and southern gospel and CCM songs. The problem is with this is when they play you don't know what the song or hymn is from. There was a few occasions I just was praying to God to speed through the four songs so I can hear my pastor preach because it was getting intense. However, we do preach great sermons at our church and they only ok CCM music if its singing for the Lord. The singers and music ministry wears modest outfits and they just pray to God and let God guide the choices of hymns. Sometimes you just hear someone shout lets sing something like Casting Crowns or or something like that but they do it beautifully and not offensively .

[JerryNumbers]

SuzyQ, a great true statement you mad and it worth repeating, "there is NO place for all the garbage that is labeled music nowadays in church." Yet churches that just a few years ago that would not allow such garbage in, are now welcoming it with open arms.

John, With how you stated that church started, like this, "a carnival, live bands, games and assorted other "fun" things," in order to keep them, they will have to keep doing that, they might even have to top that.

[ISAAC]

Baptist at least in California has become another way of saying non denominational charismatic christian church. I called many so call baptist churches in the area. One Pastor told me we are not really baptist it is just a name!! I dont want a rock band and a concert at church. I think a lot of christians want to serve God as close to serving the world as possible. I am waiting for Christian beer.

[Invicta]

My daughter and I went to a funeral in Wales, on Thursday. Our friend's wife was taken ill suddenly and he called 999 and two ambulances attended, gave her oxygen, but she died just two hours later, from pnuemonia,

My wife was not able to come as she has a bad back and would not have been able to cope with the long car journey to the land of song.

The welsh voices singing the old hymns was something special.

One hymn we sang was

Immortal honors rest on Jesus’ head;
My God, my portion, and my Living Bread;
In Him I live, upon Him cast my care;
He saves from death, destruction, and despair.

He is my Refuge in each deep distress;
The Lord my strength and glorious righteousness;
Through floods and flames He leads me safely on,
And daily makes His sovereign goodness known.

My every need He richly will supply;
Nor will His mercy ever let me die;
In Him there dwells a treasure all divine,
And matchless grace has made that treasure mine.

O that my soul could love and praise Him more,
His beauties trace, His majesty adore;
Live near His heart, upon His bosom lean;
Obey His voice, and all His will esteem.

William Gadsby

My friend is a Baptist preacher, but cannot find any suitable Baptist churches in the area, and has joined Presbytarian church.

About four years ago we visited the American Church in Luxembourg. The pastor said he had just returned from the US and he noticed that many churches there had stopped using hymns and just had choruses. He also said that some in his church wanted to turn to choruses, but he would not be changing.

[John81]

My daughter and I went to a funeral in Wales, on Thursday. Our friend's wife was taken ill suddenly and he called 999 and two ambulances attended, gave her oxygen, but she died just two hours later, from pnuemonia,

My wife was not able to come as she has a bad back and would not have been able to cope with the long car journey to the land of song.

The welsh voices singing the old hymns was something special.

One hymn we sang was

Immortal honors rest on Jesus’ head;
My God, my portion, and my Living Bread;
In Him I live, upon Him cast my care;
He saves from death, destruction, and despair.

He is my Refuge in each deep distress;
The Lord my strength and glorious righteousness;
Through floods and flames He leads me safely on,
And daily makes His sovereign goodness known.

My every need He richly will supply;
Nor will His mercy ever let me die;
In Him there dwells a treasure all divine,
And matchless grace has made that treasure mine.

O that my soul could love and praise Him more,
His beauties trace, His majesty adore;
Live near His heart, upon His bosom lean;
Obey His voice, and all His will esteem.

William Gadsby

My friend is a Baptist preacher, but cannot find any suitable Baptist churches in the area, and has joined Presbytarian church.

About four years ago we visited the American Church in Luxembourg. The pastor said he had just returned from the US and he noticed that many churches there had stopped using hymns and just had choruses. He also said that some in his church wanted to turn to choruses, but he would not be changing.

Beautiful song!

We looked for a solid Baptist church within a 50-60 mile radius of our home and found none. All but two had dropped the KJB, all had dropped all or most hymns, all had dropped dress standards, all but one had dropped most or all standards of separation, one had a female associate pastor. We finally found a non-denominational church (this church was formed non-denominational in the 1800s and is nothing like many modern non-denominational churches which are mostly about "feel good" and entertainment). Basically, our church is Independent, Fundamentalist and Conservative. We still sing the hymns, we still read the Word as part of the services, we still have prayer, we still have full sermons.

[JerryNumbers]

Invicta, That seems to be a very good song.

Isaac, I might add, even here is Arkansas many of the Baptist were going the way of the charismatic's back in the early 80's. The thing was there were only a few that recognized the direction they had headed, so they went right along with them.

I might add, your Baptist pastor friend could not have been a true Baptist, or he would not have went with the Presbyterian. I've got a neighbor that has always been a Baptist, yet in his older years he attends the church of Christ saying its as good as any.

Of course the problem could be this.

1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils

[JerryNumbers]

Invicta, That seems to be a very good song.

Isaac, I might add, even here is Arkansas many of the Baptist were going the way of the charismatic's back in the early 80's. The thing was there were only a few that recognized the direction they had headed, so they went right along with them.

I might add, your Baptist pastor friend could not have been a true Baptist, or he would not have went with the Presbyterian. I've got a neighbor that has always been a Baptist, yet in his older years he attends the church of Christ saying its as good as any.

Of course the problem could be this.

1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils

[Covenanter]

One sad & dangerous consequence of the neglect of hymns is on our children.

Once I escaped from the ritual of the CofE we sang hymns (using "Golden Bells") & choruses (CSSM) many of which are hymn choruses, & many of which are straight Scripture verses.

Nearly 60 years on I remember what I sang as a child.

What will the generation of the last 30 years remember?

I am on the "Kingsway" email list & this Easter they have some special half price CDs on offer for one day only. Today's offer is "Love Divine."

When it comes to fathers of the modern worship movement, some of them are way older than you’d think. Take Charles Wesley: prolific, profound and as powerful today as ever. Love Divine is a new compilation that unites this great father of worship with some of his descendants.

Tim Hughes, Leigh Nash, Brian Johnson, Aaron Keyes, Chris McClarney and others unite to put new tunes to some of Wesley’s greatest hymns. From ‘I Know My Redeemer LIves’ to ‘O For A Thousand Tongues To Sing’ and ‘Come Thou Long Expected Jesus’, Love Divine shows that while a quarter century may have passed since Wesley’s songs were first shared, they remain as powerful as ever today.

I will not inflict you with the link to samples .... its horrible!

[John81]

One sad & dangerous consequence of the neglect of hymns is on our children.

Once I escaped from the ritual of the CofE we sang hymns (using "Golden Bells") & choruses (CSSM) many of which are hymn choruses, & many of which are straight Scripture verses.

Nearly 60 years on I remember what I sang as a child.

What will the generation of the last 30 years remember?

I am on the "Kingsway" email list & this Easter they have some special half price CDs on offer for one day only. Today's offer is "Love Divine."



I will not inflict you with the link to samples .... its horrible!

That's an excellent point which I have thought of myself. Just as getting Scripture into children and youth benefits them for life, so does teaching them good hymns of the faith. These can stay with a person for life if learned early on and the good hymns contain so much biblical truth they nourish the soul .

Sadly, the younger generations who are mostly either not churched or attend watered down churches will not have the good hymns in their memories. They will have their memories filled with secular music and perhaps some "fun", perhaps slightly milky chorus'.

The trend in CCM in America today is taking hymns, putting them to "modern" tunes and singing them like modern songs. It's not the same. :icon_sad: