with passing on the health care law will

[JerryNumbers]

With the passing of a law that everyone has to have health care, will they soon pass a law that everyone has to have an insurance policy for long term nursing home care?

[John81]

Actually, the growing move is to deny healthcare to the elderly and severely disabled or chronically ill who the "experts" determine are not worth the cost of treating and caring for. Along with this is the move to legalize and legitimize as a good thing, doctor assisted suicide and even doctors determining on their own when it's better to "humanely" put a patient "to sleep".

We can look to various European nations for examples of this already. In one such country a survey was conducted among doctors in that country and they all said they routinely put patients to death without their knowledge, which is legal there. Among these same doctors, the vast majority said that if they were old and sick or if they had a serious illness, they would not go to a doctor in their own country for fear of the doctor ending their life. These doctors who were fine with deciding whether their patients should receive care of death, were unwilling for doctors to have the same power over them so they would go to other countries for their healthcare.

[DennisD]

Actually, the growing move is to deny healthcare to the elderly and severely disabled or chronically ill who the "experts" determine are not worth the cost of treating and caring for. Along with this is the move to legalize and legitimize as a good thing, doctor assisted suicide and even doctors determining on their own when it's better to "humanely" put a patient "to sleep".

We can look to various European nations for examples of this already. In one such country a survey was conducted among doctors in that country and they all said they routinely put patients to death without their knowledge, which is legal there. Among these same doctors, the vast majority said that if they were old and sick or if they had a serious illness, they would not go to a doctor in their own country for fear of the doctor ending their life. These doctors who were fine with deciding whether their patients should receive care of death, were unwilling for doctors to have the same power over them so they would go to other countries for their healthcare.

That disgusts me.

[Bro Jim]

This kind of "care" life or death choices started before the "Health Care Bill", look at what the VA gives our Veterans. Section "Choices about Death or Dying"

ylyc.pdf

Edited December 2, 2010 by Bro Jim

[JerryNumbers]

Yes, that stuff was already started, I found out that an elderly member of our church had taken out a long term care policy many years ago, and it hit me, they will soon force everyone to have one.



I might add they tried to force her to cancel her policy by raising the premium $50.00 per month not very long back with no warning. They compromised, if an when she had to have long term care, she would have to pay the 1st three months of care, half of the next 6 months, after that they would pay the whole cost each month. And I understand she will have to keep making monthly premiums each and every month as long as she lives, or they will cancel..

That is what I got out of her, not its possible she misrepresented some of it to me, yet she still seems pretty sharp.

[Invicta]

Yes, that stuff was already started, I found out that an elderly member of our church had taken out a long term care policy many years ago, and it hit me, they will soon force everyone to have one.



I might add they tried to force her to cancel her policy by raising the premium $50.00 per month not very long back with no warning. They compromised, if an when she had to have long term care, she would have to pay the 1st three months of care, half of the next 6 months, after that they would pay the whole cost each month. And I understand she will have to keep making monthly premiums each and every month as long as she lives, or they will cancel..

That is what I got out of her, not its possible she misrepresented some of it to me, yet she still seems pretty sharp.

That's the prOBlem with private health insurance. They try to get out of paying if it is going to be long term. The same with travel insurance. Theey point to a clause that you did not believe would ever include whar they use it for to opt out of paying.

[no name joe]

They already to. It is called Medicaid. People must spend their assets down, and then Medicaid will pay 100%. So you pay in each paycheck.

[Nathaniel]

Actually, the growing move is to deny healthcare to the elderly and severely disabled or chronically ill who the "experts" determine are not worth the cost of treating and caring for. Along with this is the move to legalize and legitimize as a good thing, doctor assisted suicide and even doctors determining on their own when it's better to "humanely" put a patient "to sleep".

We can look to various European nations for examples of this already. In one such country a survey was conducted among doctors in that country and they all said they routinely put patients to death without their knowledge, which is legal there. Among these same doctors, the vast majority said that if they were old and sick or if they had a serious illness, they would not go to a doctor in their own country for fear of the doctor ending their life. These doctors who were fine with deciding whether their patients should receive care of death, were unwilling for doctors to have the same power over them so they would go to other countries for their healthcare.

That is absolutely horrible! It is hard to imagine that a doctor can do that! It pains me hopefully this will not happen here. It would be horrible, It makes me think of my great great Grandmother.. To even think that if we were in Europe they could do that. I'll be praying about this and for those affected. Edited December 3, 2010 by Nathaniel

[no name joe]

I found statistics showing approximately 68% of patients in nursing home are funded by Medicaid, meaning the government pays 100% of their care.

Nursing homes are so expensive. Much of my line of work involves helping people plan for nursing homes and getting on Medcaid. Nursing home care costs around $4,000 per month, or almost $50,000.00 a year. WHo can afford that? Undoubtedly, most people entering a home will spend all of their savings pretty quickly. What then? Who pays? Can their children afford it? PrOBably not.

Medicaid then steps in and pays the tab. This is a very good thing. No one wants to be in a nursing home, and without exception, everyone I have dealt with (the children of those going into a home) do not want to put them there, but is their last option.

So this is already mostly government funded. LIke it or not. It has been that way for years. Most people will require nursing care at some point in life, but few can afford it.

[HappyChristian]

I found statistics showing approximately 68% of patients in nursing home are funded by Medicaid, meaning the government pays 100% of their care.

Nursing homes are so expensive. Much of my line of work involves helping people plan for nursing homes and getting on Medcaid. Nursing home care costs around $4,000 per month, or almost $50,000.00 a year. WHo can afford that? Undoubtedly, most people entering a home will spend all of their savings pretty quickly. What then? Who pays? Can their children afford it? PrOBably not.

Medicaid then steps in and pays the tab. This is a very good thing. No one wants to be in a nursing home, and without exception, everyone I have dealt with (the children of those going into a home) do not want to put them there, but is their last option.

So this is already mostly government funded. LIke it or not. It has been that way for years. Most people will require nursing care at some point in life, but few can afford it.

Yes, it is mostly government funded. But in your stats, did you find what is required of the residents? Before they can be accepted by Medicaid (which is required in order to enter most homes), they must sell their homes and GET RID of any monies they may have...Sad.
And the only money they have is a little bit of SSI - the rest goes to pay for what Medicaid doesn't. It has been that way for many years, but there needs to be a change. Change is coming, and I fear that it will not be for our better.

[no name joe]

Yes, it is mostly government funded. But in your stats, did you find what is required of the residents? Before they can be accepted by Medicaid (which is required in order to enter most homes), they must sell their homes and GET RID of any monies they may have...Sad.
And the only money they have is a little bit of SSI - the rest goes to pay for what Medicaid doesn't. It has been that way for many years, but there needs to be a change. Change is coming, and I fear that it will not be for our better.

This is an area of law I practice in. To qualify, the are not required to sell their home. They must spend all of their assets prior to qualifying for Medicaid (excluding their homes, and limited other a cssets that are not counted. They can make gifts of their assets 5 years in adance of needing nursing assistance, and those assets will not count in determining if they qualify.

Medicaid is designed to be for people who are truly impoverished. Living in a nursing home, it does not take long to become impoverished. The entire nursing home experience is a sad one, but I don't know a better way to deal with it. Even people who have accumulated a little wealth (say, $500,000) can burn through that really fast living in a nursing home. Most long term care policies I have reviewed are inadequate, and gifting away assets 5 years prior to the need for nursing care, and then getting on Medicaid is the best way to handle the prOBlem.

I'm not saying it is a great system. Nursing homes are terrible places to go, no doubt. People go there to die, and it is not a pretty business. But I am thankful that Medicaid is there to fund it for those who need the care once they have extinguished their assets. I don't know of a better system. If no one can afford to pay for the care, I don't know what the alternative could be.

Long term care insurance is not always great. Many policies I have reviewed are inadequate and pay for a very limited amount (such as 2 years). They can be good in certain situations, but they are often prohibitively expensive, due to the fact that nursing homes are prohibitively expensive and 2) they often do not meet all of the needs.

Hard topic to discuss.

[HappyChristian]

This is an area of law I practice in. To qualify, the are not required to sell their home. They must spend all of their assets prior to qualifying for Medicaid (excluding their homes, and limited other a cssets that are not counted. They can make gifts of their assets 5 years in adance of needing nursing assistance, and those assets will not count in determining if they qualify.

Medicaid is designed to be for people who are truly impoverished. Living in a nursing home, it does not take long to become impoverished. The entire nursing home experience is a sad one, but I don't know a better way to deal with it. Even people who have accumulated a little wealth (say, $500,000) can burn through that really fast living in a nursing home. Most long term care policies I have reviewed are inadequate, and gifting away assets 5 years prior to the need for nursing care, and then getting on Medicaid is the best way to handle the prOBlem.

I'm not saying it is a great system. Nursing homes are terrible places to go, no doubt. People go there to die, and it is not a pretty business. But I am thankful that Medicaid is there to fund it for those who need the care once they have extinguished their assets. I don't know of a better system. If no one can afford to pay for the care, I don't know what the alternative could be.

Long term care insurance is not always great. Many policies I have reviewed are inadequate and pay for a very limited amount (such as 2 years). They can be good in certain situations, but they are often prohibitively expensive, due to the fact that nursing homes are prohibitively expensive and 2) they often do not meet all of the needs.

Hard topic to discuss.

I bow to your greater knowledge of the law regarding this. All I know is that the residents in the nursing home where we minister had to sell their homes and get rid of their monies...there is so much corruption in federal monies, etc., that could explain it.

I'm so thankful that my grandmother lives with my parents. My dad's parents both lived with his sister, also, when they couldn't live on their own. If more people would step up to the plate and take care of their parents, that would answer to a lot of it.

[JerryNumbers]

Yes, it is mostly government funded. But in your stats, did you find what is required of the residents? Before they can be accepted by Medicaid (which is required in order to enter most homes), they must sell their homes and GET RID of any monies they may have...Sad.
And the only money they have is a little bit of SSI - the rest goes to pay for what Medicaid doesn't. It has been that way for many years, but there needs to be a change. Change is coming, and I fear that it will not be for our better.

That is partly wrong, if a person has a spouse living in their home it cannot be sold out from under them. If they have other property besides the home it can be sold to go towards their nursing home care. Least that's the way it is in Arkansas.

Now if the other property is transfered out of their name in a certain time frame before entering a nursing home, them that property is safe. I know of some that tried to do this to close to the time their loved one entered the nursing home and or after they entered the nursing home and it caused them much trouble.

I believe its the Department of Human Services, they do have councilors that will help with this matter, explain it all to you and how to go about saving things for the family, this is not true for all nursing home administrators. Some of them can get a bit to greedy.

The VA recovered some money from a nursing home for me for they had charged us more per month that allowed. The nursing home administrators was not happy with me at all over this, and tried every way possible to weasel out of it, yet I had all records and they had top return money to me after a man from the VA made 3 visits to this nursing home over this matter making a 140 mile one way trip each time. I was and am still amazed over the help the VA gave on this matter but father was a World War 2 vet with 2 purple hearts for rifle wounds received in the heat of 3 different battles.


This was at the point father and mothers money had run out paying their nursing home bill each month. Mother had been in more than 7 years at this time and father had been in a bit over one year. The cost per month at that time was some what over $2,000.00 per month each for each of them. That will eat up savings in a big hurry, I'm know it much higher now than it was them.