What is a Ruckmanite

[trc123]

I found it interesting that someone earlier in this thread applied the IFB label to BJU' date=' which is not even a Baptist institution.[/quote']

I always thought BJU was a Baptist institution. If they are not, what would you label them? The only next best label that I could think of would have to do with their stance on inter-racial marriage and the races in general.

[OLD fashioned preacher]

Bob Jones, Sr. was a Methodist evangelist and was still Methodist @ the time he started BJU. Though many of their students are from Baptist churches (not all), to the best of my knowledge BJU was never identified themselves as a Baptist institution or as a ministry of a Baptist church.

[HappyChristian]

At this point, I think they would actually be non-denominational - maybe even inter-denominational now. The first Dr. Bob was a Methodist. BJU wasn't founded with any particular denomination in mind, just the fundamental truths of the Bible. Annie, correct me if I'm wrong, please.


BTW, Katie, I like Hershey's and Dove! :Green

Old-fashioned beat me to the post!

[trc123]

Bob Jones' date=' Sr. was a Methodist evangelist and was still Methodist @ the time he started BJU. Though many of their students are from Baptist churches (not all), to the best of my knowledge BJU was never identified themselves as a Baptist institution or as a ministry of a Baptist church.[/quote']

I did not know that. Thank you.

[Guest Guest]

In case anyone's interested, here's the wikipedia page on Peter Ruckman.
God bless,
Crushmaster.

[Annie]

Perhaps you're not aware of this statement BJU recently made about their official position on the issues you mentioned. The inter-ethnic dating policy was dropped years ago (in 2000, I think).

BJU is, for lack of a better term, non-denominational. They are not a church--just a Christian school. Here's the school creed, which the students recite daily in chapel:

"I believe in the inspiration of the Bible, both the Old and New Testaments; the creation of man by the direct act of God; the incarnation and virgin birth of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ; His identification as the Son of God; His vicarious atonement for the sins of mankind by the shedding of His blood on the cross; the resurrection of his body from the tomb; His power to save men from sin; the new birth through the regeneration by the Holy Spirit; and the gift of eternal life by the grace of God."

I do know that BJU espouses the "fundamentalist" label, and they're certainly "independent" and "Bible-believing." But they're not a Baptist institution.

Sorry to go off-topic again....I'll have a look at that Ruckman link that was posted.

[deafnva77]

I personally think they dropped it out of Political Correctness. There are so many people who still feel that we should marry our own race.

[PastorHarrison]

Although Bob Sr was KJB, his replacements have been flying the flag high for compromise ever since....no one I know in FIBC circles who still holds a "straight, tight no wobbling" position on doctrine or the KJB recommends it to anyone now. But then no one recommends Hyles or Dallas or PCC anymore either.

[Annie]

I personally think they dropped it out of Political Correctness.

I really don't think they did, deafnva. If you look at the way BJU has always operated, you'll see that they're anything but politically correct. At times, they've actually gone too far the other way, IMO.

There are so many people who still feel that we should marry our own race.

Sure, and you're entitled to that opinion. I've never thought that way. Even though I attended BJU, I disagreed with the inter-ethnic dating ban (along with plenty of other things). I did receive a top-notch education there, which is why I went in the first place. I highly recommend the school, although certainly it's not for everyone. We'll probably send our kids there, if it's still standing strong in ten years.

Sorry...Still off topic...back to "what is a Ruckmanite"!!! I did read the Wikepedia page on Ruckman. It was interesting. I wonder if maybe Ruckman's experiences in the war had a lasting negative effect on him personally. He seems a bit daft to me.

[Marcus2Israel]

Personally, I know of only a handful of colleges that teach the KJV is the INERRENT, INSPIRED, WORDS of God. Maybe... um... 4 colleges. BJU doesn't teach it. That is for certain.

[Annie]

Personally' date=' I know of only a handful of colleges that teach the KJV is the INERRENT, INSPIRED, WORDS of God. Maybe... um... 4 colleges.[/quote']
Yeah, I don't know all of the ones which are KJVO, either. Obviously, Hyles-Anderson and PCC are. I'm pretty sure that West Coast, Crown, Trinity, and Ambassador are as well. But that's just off the top of my head. No doubt there are others.

[IM4given]

According to Ruckman the CIA flies space ships developed from technology garnered from aliens after they were permitted to kidnap and eat children. :loco :loco :loco

[IM4given]

:loco :loco :loco :loco :loco :loco :loco :loco :loco :loco

Ruckman holds many peculiar doctrines and has a proud, cultic attitude that he alone has truths that no one else in church history has known

In bragging up his book The Salient Verses, Mr. Ruckman makes these comments: "If you are able to obtain a copy [of Ruckman's proposed new book] you will have, in your hands, a minimum of 200 advanced revelations that came from the inerrant English text, that were completely overlooked (or ignored) by every major Christian scholar since 90 A.D. This would include all of the modern Bible revisers (1800-1999), all of the faculty members and staffs of every major 'Fundamental' (Conservative and Evangelical) seminary, university, and college in Europe and America since 1500, and every Greek and Hebrew scholar (or teacher) since 1611. ... Actually, if a Bible believer has this work he will have the accumulated knowledge of Cornelius Stam and Ethelbert Bullinger ... Clarence Larkin and C.I. Scofield, Ewing, Osborne, Tilton, and PTL ... Pember, Peters, Gaebelein, Pentecost, Lindsey, Kirban, Rockwood, Webber, and Van Impe ... plus the Puritans, Reformers, major evangelists (Moody, Sunday, Finney, Torrey, Wesley, etc.) and all that ANY Greek and Hebrew scholar ... ever found out--that was SO--in the last 200 years" (Peter Ruckman, Bible Believers' Bulletin, Jan. 1994, pp. 2,4).

In The Unknown Bible, Ruckman claims to hold to 14 "biblical truths" which all other Bible teachers have overlooked. On page 347, Ruckman modestly claims: "Do you realize that in these last two chapters, you have learned a dozen things that were unknown to the greatest Bible teachers in the world? In 2000 years of church history, they haven't even been able to find the passage which dealt with these things we have been talking about."

Some of Ruckman's long-overlooked "biblical truths" include the following:

(1) Angels are thirty-three year old males without wings; and all women in the Church Age will receive thirty-three year old male bodies at the Rapture.

(2) The plan of salvation for Tribulation saints is faith plus works and the plan of salvation in the Millennium is works alone.

(3) When the believer is born again, his soul is literally cut loose from the inside of his fleshly body. (Ruckman takes spiritual circumcision very literally!)

(4) Demons are winged creatures ranging in size from those of flies and mosquitoes to eagles and vultures.

(5) Sexual unions constitute marriage in God's sight.

(6) The soul is an invisible bodily shape. "The problem is the word 'soul,' but since there isn't one pre-millennial, soul-winning, fundamentalist who knows what a soul is (see the entire library of books published by Eerdmans, Baker, Zondervan, and the Sword of the Lord before 1970) ... The soul in the Bible is an invisible BODILY SHAPE. In the Old Testament, the soul is almost synonymous with the body, for it is STUCK TO IT till death" (Ruckman, Problem Texts, p. 145).

(7) The flood mentioned in 2 Peter 3 is not Noah's flood but is one that supposedly occurred at the judgment of the earth, when Satan was cast out of Heaven. He admits that no other Bible teacher has held this view: "Now who could get a message so simple all muddled up? Answer: Every major fundamental Bible scholar and teacher in the United States, without one exception. If you were to ask Henry Morris what the verses refer to he'd say Noah's flood: ditto Harry Rimmer, Clarence Larkin, J. Vernon McGee, Swindle (sic), MacArthur, Bob Jones III ... the Scofield Board of Editors" (Ruckman, The Unknown Bible, p. 67).

(8) "God has ordained on this earth 12 boundaries, with 12 nations, who are destined to leave this earth (transported by angels--Luke 16:22), and populate outer space infinitely and forever, beginning with the 12 constellations that are seen on the earth once every 12 months" (The Unknown Bible, p. 588).

(9) "In eternity, the Christian is in New Jerusalem; he is in his apartment house that is made out of transparent gold, like clear glass. ... He is called out on trips, and these trips take him to Mars, Jupiter, Venus, Saturn, Uranus, etc. transporting couples into gardens placing them down and saying, 'be fruitful and multiply, and replenish the earth'" (Ibid., p. 592).

(10) "I know they [demons] have to be small. ... there's two little animals that have wings. One's a fly and the other's a mosquito. Know what these things are? They're pictures of demons. THE THINGS HAVE WINGS" (Ruckman, Demons and Christians, Bible Baptist Bookstore, 1976, side 1).

Some Ruckmanites have challenged me to refute the Ruckman doctrines we have cited. I don't have to refute them; they are self refuting for the simple fact that they have no biblical authority, just as Rome's dogmas of purgatory and the ascension of Mary are self refuting. Why should we have to refute nonsense? The Bible instructs us to avoid the foolish and unlearned questions of heretics (2 Tim. 2:23; Titus 3:9-11), and Ruckman's new doctrines certainly fall into this category.

[Guest Guest]

I was first called a "Ruckmanite" several years ago by some Pentecostal Christians. I thought that it was b/c I take a stand on the KJVO Bible. I was ignorant as to what the word contained. :frog I didn't know that Ruckman was such an famous/infamous name until I met Christians (IFB's and like-minded faiths) on OLB. Then, I asked at my IFB church and got some answers. Although, I must say, that many people in my IFB church (over 3 1/2 years now) don't even know who Ruckman is. LOL.

I would like to say that I am a Bible-believer. I am IFB...but, I prefer to be called a "Follower of Jesus Christ."

Being a former-school teacher, I don't really care for labels, but I understand why people use them. God bless all Christians. :smile

[JerryNumbers]

:loco :loco :loco :loco :loco :loco :loco :loco :loco :loco

Ruckman holds many peculiar doctrines and has a proud, cultic attitude that he alone has truths that no one else in church history has known

In bragging up his book The Salient Verses, Mr. Ruckman makes these comments: "If you are able to obtain a copy [of Ruckman's proposed new book] you will have, in your hands, a minimum of 200 advanced revelations that came from the inerrant English text, that were completely overlooked (or ignored) by every major Christian scholar since 90 A.D. This would include all of the modern Bible revisers (1800-1999), all of the faculty members and staffs of every major 'Fundamental' (Conservative and Evangelical) seminary, university, and college in Europe and America since 1500, and every Greek and Hebrew scholar (or teacher) since 1611. ... Actually, if a Bible believer has this work he will have the accumulated knowledge of Cornelius Stam and Ethelbert Bullinger ... Clarence Larkin and C.I. Scofield, Ewing, Osborne, Tilton, and PTL ... Pember, Peters, Gaebelein, Pentecost, Lindsey, Kirban, Rockwood, Webber, and Van Impe ... plus the Puritans, Reformers, major evangelists (Moody, Sunday, Finney, Torrey, Wesley, etc.) and all that ANY Greek and Hebrew scholar ... ever found out--that was SO--in the last 200 years" (Peter Ruckman, Bible Believers' Bulletin, Jan. 1994, pp. 2,4).

In The Unknown Bible, Ruckman claims to hold to 14 "biblical truths" which all other Bible teachers have overlooked. On page 347, Ruckman modestly claims: "Do you realize that in these last two chapters, you have learned a dozen things that were unknown to the greatest Bible teachers in the world? In 2000 years of church history, they haven't even been able to find the passage which dealt with these things we have been talking about."

Some of Ruckman's long-overlooked "biblical truths" include the following:

(1) Angels are thirty-three year old males without wings; and all women in the Church Age will receive thirty-three year old male bodies at the Rapture.

(2) The plan of salvation for Tribulation saints is faith plus works and the plan of salvation in the Millennium is works alone.

(3) When the believer is born again, his soul is literally cut loose from the inside of his fleshly body. (Ruckman takes spiritual circumcision very literally!)

(4) Demons are winged creatures ranging in size from those of flies and mosquitoes to eagles and vultures.

(5) Sexual unions constitute marriage in God's sight.

(6) The soul is an invisible bodily shape. "The problem is the word 'soul,' but since there isn't one pre-millennial, soul-winning, fundamentalist who knows what a soul is (see the entire library of books published by Eerdmans, Baker, Zondervan, and the Sword of the Lord before 1970) ... The soul in the Bible is an invisible BODILY SHAPE. In the Old Testament, the soul is almost synonymous with the body, for it is STUCK TO IT till death" (Ruckman, Problem Texts, p. 145).

(7) The flood mentioned in 2 Peter 3 is not Noah's flood but is one that supposedly occurred at the judgment of the earth, when Satan was cast out of Heaven. He admits that no other Bible teacher has held this view: "Now who could get a message so simple all muddled up? Answer: Every major fundamental Bible scholar and teacher in the United States, without one exception. If you were to ask Henry Morris what the verses refer to he'd say Noah's flood: ditto Harry Rimmer, Clarence Larkin, J. Vernon McGee, Swindle (sic), MacArthur, Bob Jones III ... the Scofield Board of Editors" (Ruckman, The Unknown Bible, p. 67).

(8) "God has ordained on this earth 12 boundaries, with 12 nations, who are destined to leave this earth (transported by angels--Luke 16:22), and populate outer space infinitely and forever, beginning with the 12 constellations that are seen on the earth once every 12 months" (The Unknown Bible, p. 588).

(9) "In eternity, the Christian is in New Jerusalem; he is in his apartment house that is made out of transparent gold, like clear glass. ... He is called out on trips, and these trips take him to Mars, Jupiter, Venus, Saturn, Uranus, etc. transporting couples into gardens placing them down and saying, 'be fruitful and multiply, and replenish the earth'" (Ibid., p. 592).

(10) "I know they [demons] have to be small. ... there's two little animals that have wings. One's a fly and the other's a mosquito. Know what these things are? They're pictures of demons. THE THINGS HAVE WINGS" (Ruckman, Demons and Christians, Bible Baptist Bookstore, 1976, side 1).

Some Ruckmanites have challenged me to refute the Ruckman doctrines we have cited. I don't have to refute them; they are self refuting for the simple fact that they have no biblical authority, just as Rome's dogmas of purgatory and the ascension of Mary are self refuting. Why should we have to refute nonsense? The Bible instructs us to avoid the foolish and unlearned questions of heretics (2 Tim. 2:23; Titus 3:9-11), and Ruckman's new doctrines certainly fall into this category.

And to think, many Baptist defend this fellow and claim to be his followers. Does that prove many Baptist don't know the Bible nor rightly care what the Bible really teaches?