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Do these look a little strange to you?

1. I am the Lord thy God; thou shalt not have strange gods before me.
2. Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain.
3. Remember thou keep holy the Lord‘s Day.
4. Honor thy father and thy mother.
5. Thou shall not kill.
6. Thou shalt not commit adultery.
7. Thou shalt not steal.
8. Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.
9. Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife.
10. Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s goods.

Someone had told me the Catholic church had a different ten commandments. I went and looked it up, and this is what I found. It was at this website: http://www.roman-catholic-catechism.com/catholic-ten-commandments.html

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  • 4 months later...

amblivion,

re: “Well they make it easier to follow them by taking out the second commandment. Thou shalt not make onto thee any graven image.”


Actually, the Catholic Catechism includes the graven image proscription within the first commandment description. This kinda makes sense since it goes along with the spirit of not having or worshiping other “gods”.

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amblivion,

re: “Well they make it easier to follow them by taking out the second commandment. Thou shalt not make onto thee any graven image.”


Actually, the Catholic Catechism includes the graven image proscription within the first commandment description. This kinda makes sense since it goes along with the spirit of not having or worshiping other “gods”.


Out of curiousity (since I don't know all the beliefs of the IFB) do you believe we are still under the 10 Commandments? From reading the post on this thread I would think yes, but I would like to know for certain. Closely related, do you believe that we are under the Old Testament/the Old Law?
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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

amblivion,

re: “Well they make it easier to follow them by taking out the second commandment. Thou shalt not make onto thee any graven image.”


Actually, the Catholic Catechism includes the graven image proscription within the first commandment description. This kinda makes sense since it goes along with the spirit of not having or worshiping other “gods”.


I usually don't even respond to these comments but, even a Roman Church member can punch holes in this argument. Maybe a priest has a better answer.
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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist



Out of curiousity (since I don't know all the beliefs of the IFB) do you believe we are still under the 10 Commandments? From reading the post on this thread I would think yes, but I would like to know for certain. Closely related, do you believe that we are under the Old Testament/the Old Law?


Not everyone you find here is IFB. However, the Lord Jesus Christ affirmed the O.T. on many occassions so, who am I to argue with him.
I believe we are under Grace but the law convicts us of many sins which are forgiven by faith in Jesus Christ, sorry but I'm tired and someone else can provide the scriptures. Edited by 1Tim115
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Not everyone you find here is IFB. However, the Lord Jesus Christ affirmed the O.T. on many occassions so, who am I to argue with him.
I believe we are under Grace but the law convicts us of many sins which are forgiven by faith in Jesus Christ, sorry but I'm tired and someone else can provide the scriptures.


I know that not everyone on here is IFB. I am not IFB as you know, but I was curious as to the IFB's teaching on this subject. Thank you for your response.
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coc - actually Galatians 3 sums it up pretty well:

parts of it:

10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.

21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

This basically sums up the IFB view of the 10 commandments and the law. The law pointed out what sin was. And Christ delivered us from that sin.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

The 10 Commandments are just the foundation or start of 613 in the OT. 365 moral or social laws, the other 248 are ceremonial or for the temple. The NT brought us the grace of God through Christ apart from the ceremonial law. The Law condemns, the blood of Christ paid/pays the price.

Jesus affirmed them and then fulfilled them. Matt. 5:17

Paul said; Col. 2:13-15, Eph. 2:14-18

Under Grace led to perfection (maturity) by the Word of God.

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coc - actually Galatians 3 sums it up pretty well:

parts of it:

10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.

21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

This basically sums up the IFB view of the 10 commandments and the law. The law pointed out what sin was. And Christ delivered us from that sin.


Thank you Jim.
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  • 5 months later...



Thank you Jim.



Most Catholics have been brought up to believe that if they keep the commandments and live a "good" life that they will be eligible to enter heaven. All this is true if you have entered into a personal relationship with Jesus Christ realizing without Him we would be without hope. It is because Jesus Christ took our place that we inherit eternal life that we put no confidence in the flesh.( Phil 3:3) It is not until we enter into a personal relationship with Jesus Christ that we possess the power, through the indwelling Spirit and God's word, to keep the law and all the commandments. Edited by lettheredeemedsayso
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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Amazing at the beliefs out there on this subject.

As said by lettheredeemedsayso, You've got those that try to keep the law in order to be saved, which is impossible to do. One is not saved by keeping the law, besides, its impossible to keep all of the laws all of the time, and it only takes breaking one law one time to make a person lost. There was only One that accomplished that feat.

Yet, at the same time, when we are saved by grace though faith, we don't have the right to intentionally break the 10 Commandments.

We do in fact have liberty, yet liberty does not give us the right to sin. One person once said in Sunday school at a church I was asked to preach that Sunday, "I use my Christian liberty on that sin."

Ga 5:13 For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another.

Ro 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
Ro 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

No, Christian liberty does not give us an excuse to sin. It in fact it frees us up, we don't have to worry about keeping the law to stay saved, God keeps us saved, besides, keeping the law never saved a single soul.

2 Timothy 1:12 For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day.

Jude 1:24 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

Yes, we are saved by grace, and it is God who keeps the saved person saved.


The person that uses Christian liberty to sin, will be a stumbling block.

Ro 14:13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.

And will cause many to stumble.

Besides, when we sin we grieve the Holy Spirit

Eph 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

And when we grieve the Holy Spirit its going to prick our conscience. Man can find many excuses to sin, but none of them will be an excuse that will be accepted by God.

We had better be thankful for God's grace, which without, not a one of us could ever hope to see the inside of Heaven, and we need to forget about looking for loopholes.

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  • Advanced Member

Do these look a little strange to you?

1. I am the Lord thy God; thou shalt not have strange gods before me.
2. Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain.
3. Remember thou keep holy the Lord‘s Day.
4. Honor thy father and thy mother.
5. Thou shall not kill.
6. Thou shalt not commit adultery.
7. Thou shalt not steal.
8. Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.
9. Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s wife.
10. Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor’s goods.

Someone had told me the Catholic church had a different ten commandments. I went and looked it up, and this is what I found. It was at this website: http://www.roman-catholic-catechism.com/catholic-ten-commandments.html

I clicked on the link & a further link to the 10 commandments & got these, which are a summary of the usual 10:
THE TEN COMMANDMENTS
1. Do not worship other gods.
2. Do not worship idols.
3. Do not misuse God's name.
4. Keep the Sabbath holy.
5. Honor your father & mother.
6. Do not murder.
7. Do not commit adultery.
8. Do not steal.
9. Do not lie.
10. Do not covet.


That surprised me, as I have long known their suppression of the idolatry command - obviously in order to allow the worship (they call it veneration) of images.
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  • 1 year later...

Of interest; I hope to everyone. The ten commandments are carved into a stone in USA. It is written in ancient Hebrew of the time of King Solomon. Its dating is to the time of Solomon. From such carvings and dating of stones and such artifacts found in Ohio an Iowa most agree that only a group of Jews headed by a Levite priest were here hunting gold for Solomon's temple. http://www.truthontheweb.org/comstone.htm

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

I went to a focus on the family retreat and a mars hill (mark Driscoll)


Heretics, no, blasphemous apostates. They are baptist in name only, not the type of NT christians described in the Bible.

Sir, you're being blown around all over the place, being driven further and further away from the Lord and salvation.
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The Blasphemous Pedophile Pope way back removed one of the 10 commandants and spilt another to keep the number 10.

The infidel heretics still bow down to statues and graven images: Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: 5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; 6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.
Ex 20:4-6 (KJV)

One can't really feel sorry for the murderous bunch for the atrocities they have committed for 1700 yrs: This looks like a modern day newspaper article of the pedophiles ------- Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. 20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: 21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. 22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, 23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. 24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: 25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. 26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: 27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. 28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; 29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, 30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: 32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.
Romans 1:19-32 (KJV)

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

I went to a focus on the family retreat and a mars hill (mark Driscoll) retreat both baptist and they said self gratification was not a sin

While I went a catholic retreat and they said genisis 38 condemns it

All who call themselves Baptist are not the same. Some Baptists are IFB, which tend to be more Bible centered, some are SBC, which can range from liberal to Bible centered, some are Reformed Baptist which (as the name implies) hold to Reformed or Calvinist theology, there those who sprang from the Ana-Baptists, General Baptists, and a variety of other Baptists.

No matter what sort of Baptist one calls themselves, unless what they say and do is in line with Scripture, they are in error.

The IFBs and SBCs that I know of all preach against self-gratification. Most IFBs and some SBCs also stand in disagreement with Mark Driscoll on may things.

As for Focus on the Family, that's not a denomination, but an ecumenical organization of it's own which combines psychology, the Bible and other things which on occasion can be right but is often wrong.
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There was a saying in Rome before the reformation, that if there is a hell, Rome is built over it.

This is so apt,

There was a pope who when he ventured out in the streets, no woman was safe,

Then there was the pope who wanted to close all the brothels, and the citizens of Rome rose up and said their wives would not be safe if the priests could not use the brothels.

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Genesis 38 has nothing to do with 'self-gratification'; rather, it concerns the sin of a man who was to give a child to the childless widow of his brother-his sin was in having the sex, but not finishing the act-thus, he committed adultery, by not giving seed.

Self gratification, so-called, is spoken against in 1Cor 7:4, "The wife hath not power of her own body, but the husband: and likewise also the husband hath not power of his own body, but the wife".

Context is our friend.

as for the ten commandments, we are under nine of them, as they have been, in various places, repeated. The 10th, the keeping of the Sabbath, we are no longer under, as this was specifically given to the Hebrew nation and no one else.

But dealing with it as the ten commandments, that which waas written on stone, let the BIble speak:

"But if the ministration of death, written [and] engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which [glory] was to be done away: How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious? For if the ministration of condemnation [be] glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory. For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth. For if that which is done away [was] glorious, much more that which remaineth [is] glorious." (2Cor 3:7-11)

Notice the commandments, which were 'engraven on stones", are called a 'ministration of death' and of 'condemnation', and is referred to as 'that which is done away'. It is the commandments, representing the whole law, including the 10, which have been done away with, as opposed to the ministration of the spirit, which is more glorious and remaineth."

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